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General Tabletop Discussion
Character Builds & Optimization
Are the core base classes enough to build what you want to play?
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<blockquote data-quote="MerricB" data-source="post: 1699409" data-attributes="member: 3586"><p>If you're changing the rules, you're not using the core classes. So, if you give that answer, in actual fact you're saying "No, the core classes are not enough".</p><p></p><p>I am strongly of the opinion that you cannot replicate most of the new classes with core classes, prestige classes and feats - or, in the cases when you can do it, you need a character with exceptional ability scores.</p><p></p><p>Let's look at the three books I have and their classes: (I don't yet have Eberron).</p><p></p><p><strong>Miniatures Handbook</strong></p><p></p><p><strong><em>Favoured Soul</em></strong> - A spontaneously casting cleric.</p><p></p><p>Quite frankly, you can't do this one with the standard rules.</p><p></p><p><strong><em>The Healer</em></strong> - Healing spells extreme.</p><p></p><p>In theory, you can create something quite similar using the cleric class and then not using many of its benefits. A couple of feats might approach the Healing hands special ability, although you wouldn't have the benefit of the extra skill points and improved diplomatic skills...</p><p></p><p>This class really exists more as an NPC class, anyway.</p><p></p><p><strong><em>Marshal</em></strong> - Inspiring leader</p><p></p><p>The bard can approach the Marshal in abilities, although the armour the Marshal wears is a problem, and you might want a themed prestige class to replicate abilities. I don't think this class is strictly necessary, but building a character that approaches its abilities could be difficult.</p><p></p><p><strong><em>War Mage</em></strong> - Blows things up.</p><p></p><p>Even more focused than the sorcerer, though it does wear armour! This class can probably be replicated by the sorcerer, <em>but</em> there are enough tweaks to give a sorcerer problems with duplicating it properly.</p><p></p><p><strong>Complete Warrior</strong> </p><p></p><p><strong><em>Hexblade</em></strong> - Arcane 'paladin/ranger' who curses things.</p><p></p><p>Don't even try building this one - you won't be able to do it.</p><p></p><p><strong><em>Samurai</em></strong> - Two-sword wielding noble fighter in heavy armour.</p><p></p><p>Ignoring whether or not this is a samurai, mechanically this class is distinct from all other fighter builds. Conceptually, it approaches the paladin, but the paladin has a bunch of baggage that is incompatible with the Wizards' "Samurai" concept. </p><p></p><p><strong><em>Swashbuckler</em></strong> - Lightly armoured, dextrous and diplomatic fighter.</p><p></p><p>You could conceptually create this with a fighter/rogue build. Mechanically, you can't. This is a borderline class, but I've played a Swashbuckler and had a great amount of fun with it.</p><p></p><p><strong>Complete Divine</strong></p><p></p><p><strong><em>Shugenja</em></strong> - Oriental divine caster</p><p></p><p>I don't have a clue. <img src="data:image/gif;base64,R0lGODlhAQABAIAAAAAAAP///yH5BAEAAAAALAAAAAABAAEAAAIBRAA7" class="smilie smilie--sprite smilie--sprite1" alt=":)" title="Smile :)" loading="lazy" data-shortname=":)" /> More seriously, there is such a variance in the spell list, that this one is unique.</p><p></p><p><strong><em>Spirit Shaman</em></strong> - Spontaneous Druid (sort-of)</p><p></p><p>Impossible to replicate. Great concept.</p><p></p><p>###</p><p></p><p>Honestly, there are a couple of these new classes that <em>possibly</em> could be replicated with the standard rules. In the majority of cases? Not a chance.</p><p></p><p>Do you need all of these classes? Probably not. However, when you look at the D&D gaming world in general, each person will react to different classes. Certainly, I wouldn't mind playing a Samurai, I've played a Swashbuckler (and it was good!) The Favoured Soul has also been played in my games.</p><p></p><p>Cheers!</p></blockquote><p></p>
[QUOTE="MerricB, post: 1699409, member: 3586"] If you're changing the rules, you're not using the core classes. So, if you give that answer, in actual fact you're saying "No, the core classes are not enough". I am strongly of the opinion that you cannot replicate most of the new classes with core classes, prestige classes and feats - or, in the cases when you can do it, you need a character with exceptional ability scores. Let's look at the three books I have and their classes: (I don't yet have Eberron). [b]Miniatures Handbook[/b] [b][i]Favoured Soul[/i][/b] - A spontaneously casting cleric. Quite frankly, you can't do this one with the standard rules. [b][i]The Healer[/i][/b] - Healing spells extreme. In theory, you can create something quite similar using the cleric class and then not using many of its benefits. A couple of feats might approach the Healing hands special ability, although you wouldn't have the benefit of the extra skill points and improved diplomatic skills... This class really exists more as an NPC class, anyway. [b][i]Marshal[/i][/b] - Inspiring leader The bard can approach the Marshal in abilities, although the armour the Marshal wears is a problem, and you might want a themed prestige class to replicate abilities. I don't think this class is strictly necessary, but building a character that approaches its abilities could be difficult. [b][i]War Mage[/i][/b] - Blows things up. Even more focused than the sorcerer, though it does wear armour! This class can probably be replicated by the sorcerer, [i]but[/i] there are enough tweaks to give a sorcerer problems with duplicating it properly. [b]Complete Warrior[/b] [b][i]Hexblade[/i][/b] - Arcane 'paladin/ranger' who curses things. Don't even try building this one - you won't be able to do it. [b][i]Samurai[/i][/b] - Two-sword wielding noble fighter in heavy armour. Ignoring whether or not this is a samurai, mechanically this class is distinct from all other fighter builds. Conceptually, it approaches the paladin, but the paladin has a bunch of baggage that is incompatible with the Wizards' "Samurai" concept. [b][i]Swashbuckler[/i][/b] - Lightly armoured, dextrous and diplomatic fighter. You could conceptually create this with a fighter/rogue build. Mechanically, you can't. This is a borderline class, but I've played a Swashbuckler and had a great amount of fun with it. [b]Complete Divine[/b] [b][i]Shugenja[/i][/b] - Oriental divine caster I don't have a clue. :) More seriously, there is such a variance in the spell list, that this one is unique. [b][i]Spirit Shaman[/i][/b] - Spontaneous Druid (sort-of) Impossible to replicate. Great concept. ### Honestly, there are a couple of these new classes that [i]possibly[/i] could be replicated with the standard rules. In the majority of cases? Not a chance. Do you need all of these classes? Probably not. However, when you look at the D&D gaming world in general, each person will react to different classes. Certainly, I wouldn't mind playing a Samurai, I've played a Swashbuckler (and it was good!) The Favoured Soul has also been played in my games. Cheers! [/QUOTE]
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