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Assassination! DM: FourMonos Judge: Renau1g
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<blockquote data-quote="KarinsDad" data-source="post: 5957041" data-attributes="member: 2011"><p>[sblock=OOC]</p><p>Olaf's Rabid Charger attack occurs immediately after the Hybrid Charge resolves completely ("RC p.197: "If an effect has a Trigger and is neither an Immediate Action nor an Opportunity Action, assume that it behaves like an immediate Reaction, waiting for its Trigger to resolve. However, ignore this guideline when the effect has to interrupt its Trigger to function.").</p><p></p><p>The Gore does happen before the Passing Strike though. It's the equivalent of an IR trigger with the free action trigger occurring during Hydra Charge, so it occurs immediately. Then, Rohna can spend a free action to use an Action Point.</p><p></p><p>Olaf is doing a triggered melee basic attack, not a charge attack. Rohna is doing a charge, Olaf isn't. So, no Furious Charge: no extra +5 damage, no knockback, and no knocking prone, and no +2 to hit a prone target. 2d10+4 damage against an non-prone target, not 1d10+9 damage. Olaf can, however, attack whatever legal target Rohna wants to with this melee basic attack as long as Rohna hits somebody with her charge.</p><p></p><p>Technically, Hydra Charge isn't quite 100% legal here against foe <a href="http://www.enworld.org/forum/usertag.php?do=list&action=hash&hash=8" target="_blank">#8</a> . For powers (like close bursts) that target multiple opponents, each foe must be an elligible target. Foe <a href="http://www.enworld.org/forum/usertag.php?do=list&action=hash&hash=8" target="_blank">#8</a> is not elligible because Rohna did not charge closer to <a href="http://www.enworld.org/forum/usertag.php?do=list&action=hash&hash=8" target="_blank">#8</a> for every square of movement. Only <a href="http://www.enworld.org/forum/usertag.php?do=list&action=hash&hash=5" target="_blank">#5</a> and <a href="http://www.enworld.org/forum/usertag.php?do=list&action=hash&hash=7" target="_blank">#7</a> were legal foes. I think that 4M was ruling that Rohna was actually targeting <a href="http://www.enworld.org/forum/usertag.php?do=list&action=hash&hash=5" target="_blank">#5</a> with a charge, charging up to #5, and then getting the burst. If interpreted this way (the initial charge requires an initial target to handle the charge movement rules), then it works. But, there are no actual rules that suspend the charge movement rules here and allow <a href="http://www.enworld.org/forum/usertag.php?do=list&action=hash&hash=8" target="_blank">#8</a> to be targeted.</p><p></p><p>Granted, Hydra Charge should be better written to explain that it the PC has to be able to charge to the origin square and that every square charged must get the PC closer to that origin square, but the designer never thought about this issue. This happens when the designers create powers that combine different portions of the rules. I think designer intent here is that the close burst targets all enemies around the PC and hence, I am in agreement with 4M on this. Pick a foe to charge, handle the charge movement rules using that foe, then use Hybrid Charge once the PC gets there.</p><p></p><p>PS. R1 is out of pocket, so I'm putting my judge hat on here and stepping in. SG and THB, please feel free to comment.</p><p>[/sblock]</p></blockquote><p></p>
[QUOTE="KarinsDad, post: 5957041, member: 2011"] [sblock=OOC] Olaf's Rabid Charger attack occurs immediately after the Hybrid Charge resolves completely ("RC p.197: "If an effect has a Trigger and is neither an Immediate Action nor an Opportunity Action, assume that it behaves like an immediate Reaction, waiting for its Trigger to resolve. However, ignore this guideline when the effect has to interrupt its Trigger to function."). The Gore does happen before the Passing Strike though. It's the equivalent of an IR trigger with the free action trigger occurring during Hydra Charge, so it occurs immediately. Then, Rohna can spend a free action to use an Action Point. Olaf is doing a triggered melee basic attack, not a charge attack. Rohna is doing a charge, Olaf isn't. So, no Furious Charge: no extra +5 damage, no knockback, and no knocking prone, and no +2 to hit a prone target. 2d10+4 damage against an non-prone target, not 1d10+9 damage. Olaf can, however, attack whatever legal target Rohna wants to with this melee basic attack as long as Rohna hits somebody with her charge. Technically, Hydra Charge isn't quite 100% legal here against foe [URL=http://www.enworld.org/forum/usertag.php?do=list&action=hash&hash=8]#8[/URL] . For powers (like close bursts) that target multiple opponents, each foe must be an elligible target. Foe [URL=http://www.enworld.org/forum/usertag.php?do=list&action=hash&hash=8]#8[/URL] is not elligible because Rohna did not charge closer to [URL=http://www.enworld.org/forum/usertag.php?do=list&action=hash&hash=8]#8[/URL] for every square of movement. Only [URL=http://www.enworld.org/forum/usertag.php?do=list&action=hash&hash=5]#5[/URL] and [URL=http://www.enworld.org/forum/usertag.php?do=list&action=hash&hash=7]#7[/URL] were legal foes. I think that 4M was ruling that Rohna was actually targeting [URL=http://www.enworld.org/forum/usertag.php?do=list&action=hash&hash=5]#5[/URL] with a charge, charging up to #5, and then getting the burst. If interpreted this way (the initial charge requires an initial target to handle the charge movement rules), then it works. But, there are no actual rules that suspend the charge movement rules here and allow [URL=http://www.enworld.org/forum/usertag.php?do=list&action=hash&hash=8]#8[/URL] to be targeted. Granted, Hydra Charge should be better written to explain that it the PC has to be able to charge to the origin square and that every square charged must get the PC closer to that origin square, but the designer never thought about this issue. This happens when the designers create powers that combine different portions of the rules. I think designer intent here is that the close burst targets all enemies around the PC and hence, I am in agreement with 4M on this. Pick a foe to charge, handle the charge movement rules using that foe, then use Hybrid Charge once the PC gets there. PS. R1 is out of pocket, so I'm putting my judge hat on here and stepping in. SG and THB, please feel free to comment. [/sblock] [/QUOTE]
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