Menu
News
All News
Dungeons & Dragons
Level Up: Advanced 5th Edition
Pathfinder
Starfinder
Warhammer
2d20 System
Year Zero Engine
Industry News
Reviews
Dragon Reflections
Columns
Weekly Digests
Weekly News Digest
Freebies, Sales & Bundles
RPG Print News
RPG Crowdfunding News
Game Content
ENterplanetary DimENsions
Mythological Figures
Opinion
Worlds of Design
Peregrine's Next
RPG Evolution
Other Columns
From the Freelancing Frontline
Monster ENcyclopedia
WotC/TSR Alumni Look Back
4 Hours w/RSD (Ryan Dancey)
The Road to 3E (Jonathan Tweet)
Greenwood's Realms (Ed Greenwood)
Drawmij's TSR (Jim Ward)
Community
Forums & Topics
Forum List
Latest Posts
Forum list
*Dungeons & Dragons
Level Up: Advanced 5th Edition
D&D Older Editions
*TTRPGs General
*Pathfinder & Starfinder
EN Publishing
*Geek Talk & Media
Search forums
Chat/Discord
Resources
Wiki
Pages
Latest activity
Media
New media
New comments
Search media
Downloads
Latest reviews
Search resources
EN Publishing
Store
EN5ider
Adventures in ZEITGEIST
Awfully Cheerful Engine
What's OLD is NEW
Judge Dredd & The Worlds Of 2000AD
War of the Burning Sky
Level Up: Advanced 5E
Events & Releases
Upcoming Events
Private Events
Featured Events
Socials!
Twitch
YouTube
Facebook (EN Publishing)
Facebook (EN World)
Twitter
Instagram
TikTok
Podcast
Features
Top 5 RPGs Compiled Charts 2004-Present
Adventure Game Industry Market Research Summary (RPGs) V1.0
Ryan Dancey: Acquiring TSR
Q&A With Gary Gygax
D&D Rules FAQs
TSR, WotC, & Paizo: A Comparative History
D&D Pronunciation Guide
Million Dollar TTRPG Kickstarters
Tabletop RPG Podcast Hall of Fame
Eric Noah's Unofficial D&D 3rd Edition News
D&D in the Mainstream
D&D & RPG History
About Morrus
Log in
Register
What's new
Search
Search
Search titles only
By:
Forums & Topics
Forum List
Latest Posts
Forum list
*Dungeons & Dragons
Level Up: Advanced 5th Edition
D&D Older Editions
*TTRPGs General
*Pathfinder & Starfinder
EN Publishing
*Geek Talk & Media
Search forums
Chat/Discord
Menu
Log in
Register
Install the app
Install
Community
General Tabletop Discussion
*Geek Talk & Media
Avengers: Endgame SPOILER THREAD
JavaScript is disabled. For a better experience, please enable JavaScript in your browser before proceeding.
You are using an out of date browser. It may not display this or other websites correctly.
You should upgrade or use an
alternative browser
.
Reply to thread
Message
<blockquote data-quote="Umbran" data-source="post: 7601099" data-attributes="member: 177"><p>I have only seen it the once, and I was a bit busy experiencing to remember all the statements in their entirety. But, I'm still of the opinion that my interpretation is consistent with what is seen.</p><p></p><p></p><p></p><p>It is a *movie*, so there's probably no clear truth. The fact that time travel is involved isn't the determiner, but how much the storytellers stick to their logic.</p><p></p><p>There's a second question as to whether there's sufficient information in the movie to determine what that truth is, without having to assume some things on our part.</p><p></p><p></p><p></p><p>I would want to review *exactly* what the Ancient One said, but again, I'm still of the opinion that what I said was consistent with their exposition. Specifically, I think she already references her timeline as different from the Hulk's, when no notable changes have been made, yet. In any case, we have the "you cannot change your own past" line from several folks before that. If you cannot change your own past, that pretty strongly argues for at least the idea that every act of time travelling backwards creates an alternate timeline. That means they created at least... five?</p><p></p><p>Alternate 1: Hulk, Ant Man, Iron Man, and Cap all go back to the Battle of New York.</p><p>Alternate 2: Rocket and Thor go to Asgard</p><p>Alternate 3: Nebula, War Machine, Hawkeye, Black Widow go to Spaaaaaace!</p><p>Alternate 4: Iron Man and Cap go back to the Army Base in 1970.</p><p>Alternate 5: Captain America goes back to be with Peggy Carter.</p><p></p><p></p><p></p><p></p><p>The film makers have said that Cap spent his life in an alternate timeline, my #5, above. I believe the quotes for that can be found upthread. </p><p></p><p>In fact, this *has* to be true, because he comes up with an unbroken Shield. That can't be our Cap's original. It must be from an alternate timeline. Or he had a second one made while back in the past? That doesn't make a lot of sense.</p><p></p><p></p><p></p><p>Well, they did that once, in uncontrolled circumstances, before they had Tony's input on time travel. They didn't "work it out" so much as it happened on one of their experiments. That doesn't mean they can replicate that in a controlled manner.... But yeah, they could use time shenanigans to de-age him... but that brings up a question of why anyone ever ages in the universe ever again, and the ethics of withholding de-aging from the general populace. Don't go there.</p><p></p><p>They could also invoke the Super Soldier Serum, since in normal comic continuity that keeps him nigh-immune to aging (and he has lost it once or twice in the comics, and aged as a result). Give him another shot of Vita Rays, and he's good to go! They could also invoke what I said, above - that the Old Cap comes from an alternate timeline, and our Cap eventually comes back from his trip through the portal, just later than planned. </p><p></p><p>I'm guessing both Evans and Downey are done, though, and unlikely to show up except in flashbacks and recordings.</p><p></p><p></p><p></p><p>I loved that moment. Just plain old fashioned empathy, at its finest!</p><p></p><p>Also, I am a nigh-unabashed Cap fan. The moment of him getting Mjollnir in the big fight (and, Thor's reaction - when Cap first almost moved the hammer in Age of Ultron, Thor looked worried. In this one it was a joyful, "I knew it!!!1!") Growth of both Cap (now worthy) and Thor. I was happy that I didn't twig to that possibility when Thor came back with the alternate hammer.</p><p></p><p>I also appreciated that they also put some goals other than "kill them all" into the fight. The Great Game of Keep Away gave a flow to the big fight that would have otherwise been extremely hard to follow.</p><p></p><p>And, the trading of places: In Infinity War, Tony with Parker as he dusts, and now, Parker with Tony as he's in his final moments.... They must have sewed the actor's mouth shut to keep him from blurting out that spoiler. <img src="data:image/gif;base64,R0lGODlhAQABAIAAAAAAAP///yH5BAEAAAAALAAAAAABAAEAAAIBRAA7" class="smilie smilie--sprite smilie--sprite1" alt=":)" title="Smile :)" loading="lazy" data-shortname=":)" /></p></blockquote><p></p>
[QUOTE="Umbran, post: 7601099, member: 177"] I have only seen it the once, and I was a bit busy experiencing to remember all the statements in their entirety. But, I'm still of the opinion that my interpretation is consistent with what is seen. It is a *movie*, so there's probably no clear truth. The fact that time travel is involved isn't the determiner, but how much the storytellers stick to their logic. There's a second question as to whether there's sufficient information in the movie to determine what that truth is, without having to assume some things on our part. I would want to review *exactly* what the Ancient One said, but again, I'm still of the opinion that what I said was consistent with their exposition. Specifically, I think she already references her timeline as different from the Hulk's, when no notable changes have been made, yet. In any case, we have the "you cannot change your own past" line from several folks before that. If you cannot change your own past, that pretty strongly argues for at least the idea that every act of time travelling backwards creates an alternate timeline. That means they created at least... five? Alternate 1: Hulk, Ant Man, Iron Man, and Cap all go back to the Battle of New York. Alternate 2: Rocket and Thor go to Asgard Alternate 3: Nebula, War Machine, Hawkeye, Black Widow go to Spaaaaaace! Alternate 4: Iron Man and Cap go back to the Army Base in 1970. Alternate 5: Captain America goes back to be with Peggy Carter. The film makers have said that Cap spent his life in an alternate timeline, my #5, above. I believe the quotes for that can be found upthread. In fact, this *has* to be true, because he comes up with an unbroken Shield. That can't be our Cap's original. It must be from an alternate timeline. Or he had a second one made while back in the past? That doesn't make a lot of sense. Well, they did that once, in uncontrolled circumstances, before they had Tony's input on time travel. They didn't "work it out" so much as it happened on one of their experiments. That doesn't mean they can replicate that in a controlled manner.... But yeah, they could use time shenanigans to de-age him... but that brings up a question of why anyone ever ages in the universe ever again, and the ethics of withholding de-aging from the general populace. Don't go there. They could also invoke the Super Soldier Serum, since in normal comic continuity that keeps him nigh-immune to aging (and he has lost it once or twice in the comics, and aged as a result). Give him another shot of Vita Rays, and he's good to go! They could also invoke what I said, above - that the Old Cap comes from an alternate timeline, and our Cap eventually comes back from his trip through the portal, just later than planned. I'm guessing both Evans and Downey are done, though, and unlikely to show up except in flashbacks and recordings. I loved that moment. Just plain old fashioned empathy, at its finest! Also, I am a nigh-unabashed Cap fan. The moment of him getting Mjollnir in the big fight (and, Thor's reaction - when Cap first almost moved the hammer in Age of Ultron, Thor looked worried. In this one it was a joyful, "I knew it!!!1!") Growth of both Cap (now worthy) and Thor. I was happy that I didn't twig to that possibility when Thor came back with the alternate hammer. I also appreciated that they also put some goals other than "kill them all" into the fight. The Great Game of Keep Away gave a flow to the big fight that would have otherwise been extremely hard to follow. And, the trading of places: In Infinity War, Tony with Parker as he dusts, and now, Parker with Tony as he's in his final moments.... They must have sewed the actor's mouth shut to keep him from blurting out that spoiler. :) [/QUOTE]
Insert quotes…
Verification
Post reply
Community
General Tabletop Discussion
*Geek Talk & Media
Avengers: Endgame SPOILER THREAD
Top