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General Tabletop Discussion
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Balancing Investigation checks and player descriptions
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<blockquote data-quote="pming" data-source="post: 6909641" data-attributes="member: 45197"><p>Hiya!</p><p></p><p></p><p></p><p>Um, so you mean, like, playing a role-playing game that's not on a computer? <img src="data:image/gif;base64,R0lGODlhAQABAIAAAAAAAP///yH5BAEAAAAALAAAAAABAAEAAAIBRAA7" class="smilie smilie--sprite smilie--sprite2" alt=";)" title="Wink ;)" loading="lazy" data-shortname=";)" /></p><p></p><p>That 'slow down' isn't "grinding to a halt". That's, LITERALLY, 1/3rd of the game focus for 5e in particular. This is part of the fun! <em>"Hmmm...I'll double check that bookshelf again. I'm looking for rare books, things that look out of place, or switches to open secret doors and such by pushing, pulling, or moving books"</em> <-- this is the "Exploration" part of table-top RPG's.</p><p></p><p>If you are seeing this as "grinding to a halt", then that simply means that you don't really enjoy all the "immersion and exploration" of TTRPG's. This isn't bad, btw, just a preference.</p><p></p><p></p><p></p><p>It shouldn't feel close. To me, that 'situation' is the same as if the player says "I shoot my crossbow at him!", and then me thinking that I should just let him automatically drop his crossbow, pull out his sword, and attack the thief that he didn't see leap out of the shadows at him.</p><p></p><p>If the player doesn't indicate any interest in the chest other than the coins...then so be it. It's the same as if the player is described a room as "Long and dark, with wide pillars every 10' or so; the inner area lit every other pillar by a dull torch, casting many dark shadows throughout the room. A cultist, with his back to you, seems engrossed in a book he is reading at the end of the room, 40' away". If a player just says "I shoot him!", ok. If he says "I rush down the room and stab him with my sword!", ok. If he says "I start to cast a spell", ok. He starts, and then the thief leaps out of the shadows. BUT, if he says "I look around the room a bit, without moving. I shield my eyes from the direct torch flame to see if I can see anything behind the pillars...in the dark"...Ahhhhh!....now the player gets to make an active Perception roll.</p><p></p><p>So yeah...if you want to have something more "game'y" to go on, use Passive skill rolls. If the PC's passive Perception beats the DC of the hidden compartment, he notices it. Then it's up to the player to figure out how to open it or whatever (Investigation check...or he could just start hacking into it with a hand axe, but that might damage the valuables hidden [cut the scroll, smash the bottle, dent/marr the gold whiskey flask, etc]). I use Perception to have PC's notice things...but they use Investigation to figure out how to deal with them (open, close, overcome, or otherwise 'use' whatever they found; e.g., Perception = you find a secret door // Investigation = you figure out how to open the secret door you found).</p><p></p><p>^_^</p><p></p><p>Paul L. Ming</p></blockquote><p></p>
[QUOTE="pming, post: 6909641, member: 45197"] Hiya! Um, so you mean, like, playing a role-playing game that's not on a computer? ;) That 'slow down' isn't "grinding to a halt". That's, LITERALLY, 1/3rd of the game focus for 5e in particular. This is part of the fun! [I]"Hmmm...I'll double check that bookshelf again. I'm looking for rare books, things that look out of place, or switches to open secret doors and such by pushing, pulling, or moving books"[/I] <-- this is the "Exploration" part of table-top RPG's. If you are seeing this as "grinding to a halt", then that simply means that you don't really enjoy all the "immersion and exploration" of TTRPG's. This isn't bad, btw, just a preference. It shouldn't feel close. To me, that 'situation' is the same as if the player says "I shoot my crossbow at him!", and then me thinking that I should just let him automatically drop his crossbow, pull out his sword, and attack the thief that he didn't see leap out of the shadows at him. If the player doesn't indicate any interest in the chest other than the coins...then so be it. It's the same as if the player is described a room as "Long and dark, with wide pillars every 10' or so; the inner area lit every other pillar by a dull torch, casting many dark shadows throughout the room. A cultist, with his back to you, seems engrossed in a book he is reading at the end of the room, 40' away". If a player just says "I shoot him!", ok. If he says "I rush down the room and stab him with my sword!", ok. If he says "I start to cast a spell", ok. He starts, and then the thief leaps out of the shadows. BUT, if he says "I look around the room a bit, without moving. I shield my eyes from the direct torch flame to see if I can see anything behind the pillars...in the dark"...Ahhhhh!....now the player gets to make an active Perception roll. So yeah...if you want to have something more "game'y" to go on, use Passive skill rolls. If the PC's passive Perception beats the DC of the hidden compartment, he notices it. Then it's up to the player to figure out how to open it or whatever (Investigation check...or he could just start hacking into it with a hand axe, but that might damage the valuables hidden [cut the scroll, smash the bottle, dent/marr the gold whiskey flask, etc]). I use Perception to have PC's notice things...but they use Investigation to figure out how to deal with them (open, close, overcome, or otherwise 'use' whatever they found; e.g., Perception = you find a secret door // Investigation = you figure out how to open the secret door you found). ^_^ Paul L. Ming [/QUOTE]
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