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<blockquote data-quote="Alzrius" data-source="post: 8542529" data-attributes="member: 8461"><p>Part of it, I think, is that a lot of GMs don't fully utilize monsters in a way that makes the most of their strengths, leading them to end up playing weaker than they look.</p><p></p><p>This is why the distinction between "spine CR" and "total CR" in Bad Axe Games' <a href="https://www.drivethrurpg.com/product/109875/Trailblazer-Teratologue?affiliate_id=820" target="_blank"><em>Trailblazer: Teratologue</em></a> (affiliate link) was so brilliant. While the latter is the typical CR that's in the book, the former analyzes only the "spine" of the creature; that is, the basic Hit Dice, BAB, saves, and one or two other standard values that all monsters have.</p><p></p><p>The reason they analyze that separately is simple: a creature's Challenge Rating is a measure of <em>all</em> of its statistics. Now, not everything contributes evenly to the final number; skills make much less of an impact than feats, for instance. But ultimately, the total CR measures everything the creature can do.</p><p></p><p>That matters because if a creature has, say, a notable number of spell-like abilities (such as a <a href="https://www.d20pfsrd.com/bestiary/monster-listings/outsiders/devil/pit-fiend/" target="_blank">pit fiend</a>), then it's as much a caster as it is a martial enemy, so if you ignore its spell-like abilities, or only use them a little (i.e. have the pit fiend use its quickened <em>fireball</em> ability once or twice and nothing else), then you're not presenting the creature at its full CR, and so it's no surprise that a group of PCs whose APL equals the total CR will walk all over it. The pit fiend might have a total CR of 20, but you know what it's spine CR is?</p><p></p><p>Just under 10.</p><p></p><p>Running a pit fiend as a melee monster, who rushes in to trade blows with the fighter and little else, will result in a level 20 party dismantling it handily. Instead, it should be run more like an enemy spellcaster who just happens to also not be helpless in melee. Keep that in mind (as general advice for various enemies), and I suspect that will result in a lot more mileage being gotten out of a great deal of enemies that the PCs encounter.</p></blockquote><p></p>
[QUOTE="Alzrius, post: 8542529, member: 8461"] Part of it, I think, is that a lot of GMs don't fully utilize monsters in a way that makes the most of their strengths, leading them to end up playing weaker than they look. This is why the distinction between "spine CR" and "total CR" in Bad Axe Games' [URL='https://www.drivethrurpg.com/product/109875/Trailblazer-Teratologue?affiliate_id=820'][I]Trailblazer: Teratologue[/I][/URL] (affiliate link) was so brilliant. While the latter is the typical CR that's in the book, the former analyzes only the "spine" of the creature; that is, the basic Hit Dice, BAB, saves, and one or two other standard values that all monsters have. The reason they analyze that separately is simple: a creature's Challenge Rating is a measure of [I]all[/I] of its statistics. Now, not everything contributes evenly to the final number; skills make much less of an impact than feats, for instance. But ultimately, the total CR measures everything the creature can do. That matters because if a creature has, say, a notable number of spell-like abilities (such as a [URL='https://www.d20pfsrd.com/bestiary/monster-listings/outsiders/devil/pit-fiend/']pit fiend[/URL]), then it's as much a caster as it is a martial enemy, so if you ignore its spell-like abilities, or only use them a little (i.e. have the pit fiend use its quickened [I]fireball[/I] ability once or twice and nothing else), then you're not presenting the creature at its full CR, and so it's no surprise that a group of PCs whose APL equals the total CR will walk all over it. The pit fiend might have a total CR of 20, but you know what it's spine CR is? Just under 10. Running a pit fiend as a melee monster, who rushes in to trade blows with the fighter and little else, will result in a level 20 party dismantling it handily. Instead, it should be run more like an enemy spellcaster who just happens to also not be helpless in melee. Keep that in mind (as general advice for various enemies), and I suspect that will result in a lot more mileage being gotten out of a great deal of enemies that the PCs encounter. [/QUOTE]
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