Menu
News
All News
Dungeons & Dragons
Level Up: Advanced 5th Edition
Pathfinder
Starfinder
Warhammer
2d20 System
Year Zero Engine
Industry News
Reviews
Dragon Reflections
Columns
Weekly Digests
Weekly News Digest
Freebies, Sales & Bundles
RPG Print News
RPG Crowdfunding News
Game Content
ENterplanetary DimENsions
Mythological Figures
Opinion
Worlds of Design
Peregrine's Next
RPG Evolution
Other Columns
From the Freelancing Frontline
Monster ENcyclopedia
WotC/TSR Alumni Look Back
4 Hours w/RSD (Ryan Dancey)
The Road to 3E (Jonathan Tweet)
Greenwood's Realms (Ed Greenwood)
Drawmij's TSR (Jim Ward)
Community
Forums & Topics
Forum List
Latest Posts
Forum list
*Dungeons & Dragons
Level Up: Advanced 5th Edition
D&D Older Editions
*TTRPGs General
*Pathfinder & Starfinder
EN Publishing
*Geek Talk & Media
Search forums
Chat/Discord
Resources
Wiki
Pages
Latest activity
Media
New media
New comments
Search media
Downloads
Latest reviews
Search resources
EN Publishing
Store
EN5ider
Adventures in ZEITGEIST
Awfully Cheerful Engine
What's OLD is NEW
Judge Dredd & The Worlds Of 2000AD
War of the Burning Sky
Level Up: Advanced 5E
Events & Releases
Upcoming Events
Private Events
Featured Events
Socials!
Twitch
YouTube
Facebook (EN Publishing)
Facebook (EN World)
Twitter
Instagram
TikTok
Podcast
Features
Top 5 RPGs Compiled Charts 2004-Present
Adventure Game Industry Market Research Summary (RPGs) V1.0
Ryan Dancey: Acquiring TSR
Q&A With Gary Gygax
D&D Rules FAQs
TSR, WotC, & Paizo: A Comparative History
D&D Pronunciation Guide
Million Dollar TTRPG Kickstarters
Tabletop RPG Podcast Hall of Fame
Eric Noah's Unofficial D&D 3rd Edition News
D&D in the Mainstream
D&D & RPG History
About Morrus
Log in
Register
What's new
Search
Search
Search titles only
By:
Forums & Topics
Forum List
Latest Posts
Forum list
*Dungeons & Dragons
Level Up: Advanced 5th Edition
D&D Older Editions
*TTRPGs General
*Pathfinder & Starfinder
EN Publishing
*Geek Talk & Media
Search forums
Chat/Discord
Menu
Log in
Register
Install the app
Install
Community
General Tabletop Discussion
*Dungeons & Dragons
D&D 5.5e; Your wish for 5.5e update.
JavaScript is disabled. For a better experience, please enable JavaScript in your browser before proceeding.
You are using an out of date browser. It may not display this or other websites correctly.
You should upgrade or use an
alternative browser
.
Reply to thread
Message
<blockquote data-quote="Jer" data-source="post: 7032315" data-attributes="member: 19857"><p>Yup. When Wizards first took over D&D they used a tweaked version of the "successful" RPG publishing business model - put out core books, then put out supplements constantly to gleam crumbs from supplement money and to try to sell more core books to new players. A game line had to support itself entirely or else it was axed and so D&D had to be self supporting - if it wasn't bringing in a consistent amount of dollars per quarter then it would get the axe in favor of a different game. That's how TSR ran D&D in the 90s and Wizards looked at that model, decided that the only problem with it was that TSR basically had game lines that competed with each other (in the sense of having multiple settings each with their own releases every month) and trimmed it back to a roughly one book per month release schedule making those releases overall "setting neutral". In order to fill those one-book-a-month releases with content they were essentially forced to pack them with "crunch" - their market research suggested that that was a common desire across D&D players. A group might not want to buy anything but Dark Sun setting books, but they'd be up for buying any "setting neutral" book full of new rules options. And so 3e was retooled in a way that made it easier to write crunchy rules supplements and plug them into the system (using a whole lot of 90s game design lessons learned about making systems that were easily expandable with splatbooks).</p><p></p><p>The problem with that approach is that if you're releasing a book every month full of new rules options a) your playtesting probably isn't that robust so b) you both break the game quicker (by releasing game-breaking options) and you discover existing broken bits in the game quicker (because you're pushing its limits in your design a lot faster that a slower release schedule). And so you start to hear the clamor for a revised edition that will bring together all of the rule fixes you've built over the course of a few years into a single place. Add to that the fact that "new revised edition" sounds like "more sales of core books" and you get the edition treadmill that Wizards was on from 3e through the end of 4e.</p><p></p><p>Of course the problem with THAT has become obvious in retrospect - every new edition release is a jumping off point for players who have invested time and money into the game. And so Wizards saw diminishing returns for each of their new edition pushes - hence the switch in marketing strategy, the shrinking of the D&D team, and the push to consider D&D "as a brand" instead of "as a game" to justify the continued existence of the D&D team to corporate mucky-mucks. (Marvel and DC comics see something similar with their strategies of rebooting books with new issue #1s periodically - a reboot has become a great jumping off point for old readers looking for an excuse to talk themselves out of buying the book every month. It's the same thing here, except that the players of older editions tend to just keep playing those older editions.)</p><p></p><p>I don't see a new edition coming any time soon because there is literally no reason for a new edition to come anytime soon. There aren't enough "official" new rules in the game post-release to justify any kind of new edition. They can put out a new rules-heavy tome every year for the next 10 years and still not have the massive quantity of official rules added to the game that Wizards put out between 3.0 and 3.5. Any attempt to release a new edition at this point would be a pure cash-grab - and a stupid one. They are far better off sticking with their original idea of making 5e the "evergreen" version of D&D and saving their rule changes as optional extensions.</p></blockquote><p></p>
[QUOTE="Jer, post: 7032315, member: 19857"] Yup. When Wizards first took over D&D they used a tweaked version of the "successful" RPG publishing business model - put out core books, then put out supplements constantly to gleam crumbs from supplement money and to try to sell more core books to new players. A game line had to support itself entirely or else it was axed and so D&D had to be self supporting - if it wasn't bringing in a consistent amount of dollars per quarter then it would get the axe in favor of a different game. That's how TSR ran D&D in the 90s and Wizards looked at that model, decided that the only problem with it was that TSR basically had game lines that competed with each other (in the sense of having multiple settings each with their own releases every month) and trimmed it back to a roughly one book per month release schedule making those releases overall "setting neutral". In order to fill those one-book-a-month releases with content they were essentially forced to pack them with "crunch" - their market research suggested that that was a common desire across D&D players. A group might not want to buy anything but Dark Sun setting books, but they'd be up for buying any "setting neutral" book full of new rules options. And so 3e was retooled in a way that made it easier to write crunchy rules supplements and plug them into the system (using a whole lot of 90s game design lessons learned about making systems that were easily expandable with splatbooks). The problem with that approach is that if you're releasing a book every month full of new rules options a) your playtesting probably isn't that robust so b) you both break the game quicker (by releasing game-breaking options) and you discover existing broken bits in the game quicker (because you're pushing its limits in your design a lot faster that a slower release schedule). And so you start to hear the clamor for a revised edition that will bring together all of the rule fixes you've built over the course of a few years into a single place. Add to that the fact that "new revised edition" sounds like "more sales of core books" and you get the edition treadmill that Wizards was on from 3e through the end of 4e. Of course the problem with THAT has become obvious in retrospect - every new edition release is a jumping off point for players who have invested time and money into the game. And so Wizards saw diminishing returns for each of their new edition pushes - hence the switch in marketing strategy, the shrinking of the D&D team, and the push to consider D&D "as a brand" instead of "as a game" to justify the continued existence of the D&D team to corporate mucky-mucks. (Marvel and DC comics see something similar with their strategies of rebooting books with new issue #1s periodically - a reboot has become a great jumping off point for old readers looking for an excuse to talk themselves out of buying the book every month. It's the same thing here, except that the players of older editions tend to just keep playing those older editions.) I don't see a new edition coming any time soon because there is literally no reason for a new edition to come anytime soon. There aren't enough "official" new rules in the game post-release to justify any kind of new edition. They can put out a new rules-heavy tome every year for the next 10 years and still not have the massive quantity of official rules added to the game that Wizards put out between 3.0 and 3.5. Any attempt to release a new edition at this point would be a pure cash-grab - and a stupid one. They are far better off sticking with their original idea of making 5e the "evergreen" version of D&D and saving their rule changes as optional extensions. [/QUOTE]
Insert quotes…
Verification
Post reply
Community
General Tabletop Discussion
*Dungeons & Dragons
D&D 5.5e; Your wish for 5.5e update.
Top