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[D&D Design Discussion] Preserving the "Sweet Spot"
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<blockquote data-quote="Valvorik" data-source="post: 3017953" data-attributes="member: 43682"><p><strong>Currently 15th level and okay</strong></p><p></p><p>Running a game where most PC's are 15th level (5 players) and it's working.</p><p></p><p>That said, have in place houserules similar to some suggested already and addressing various issues. Would be a little much to post all (campaign bible is over 500 pages at this point), but some key ones:</p><p></p><p>- have reduced effectiveness of information guaranteeing spells (commune etc.) and travel spells (use MC's UA's version of teleport, cap all spells like phantom steed and windwalk at 100' speed so that nothing flies faster than air elemental);</p><p>- have revised raise dead/resurrection spells including removing true resurrection's "painless no loss aspect", all coming back from death is painful, have removed clone entirely as a means of creating playable replacement characters;</p><p>- have adopted WOTC's epic fixes to most "save or die" spells so that they're usually "save or uber damage";</p><p>- have adopated Arcana Unearthed variant death and dying rules with substantial house rules that ensure less character death but just as much of a brake on level advancement over time for taking damage = hp +10;</p><p>- have announced intent in next campaign to remove additional spells that "take the spotlight off skills", again modelled on MC's and some WOTC designer musings;</p><p>- apply rigorous connections of cultural and other backgrounds to prestige classes that avoids too much PrC'ing.</p><p>- add new feats from published sources and routinely do not add many that over-stack or are just "too good" in my view, same for new spells etc.</p><p></p><p>You will find if you look at Monte Cook's Unearthed Arcana that a number of "problematic" spells people have cited don't exist in that setting, a bit of a tip off.</p><p></p><p>I am blessed with players who voluntarily seek comprehensive character development as much as min/max objectives and who knowingly swerve from "power gamer" to "character I want to play".</p><p></p><p>I try to ration what sorts of accomplishments characters reach at different levels so that it would not be before 19+ that plane-spanning threats etc. figure. E.G., one reason I revised "return to temple of elemental evil" and ran it for 15th level was that the scale of threat was such lower level characters should not be the ones dealing with it and even then intended the "worst outcome" to be disasterous on a regional scale and only threaten world on a longer time horizon that other forces could hope to counter.</p><p></p><p>All of that said, find lots of good discussion in this thread identifying issues to address if you want to "take adventures out of dungeon" and don't want to follow the WOTC path of moving high level adventures into plane hopping.</p></blockquote><p></p>
[QUOTE="Valvorik, post: 3017953, member: 43682"] [b]Currently 15th level and okay[/b] Running a game where most PC's are 15th level (5 players) and it's working. That said, have in place houserules similar to some suggested already and addressing various issues. Would be a little much to post all (campaign bible is over 500 pages at this point), but some key ones: - have reduced effectiveness of information guaranteeing spells (commune etc.) and travel spells (use MC's UA's version of teleport, cap all spells like phantom steed and windwalk at 100' speed so that nothing flies faster than air elemental); - have revised raise dead/resurrection spells including removing true resurrection's "painless no loss aspect", all coming back from death is painful, have removed clone entirely as a means of creating playable replacement characters; - have adopted WOTC's epic fixes to most "save or die" spells so that they're usually "save or uber damage"; - have adopated Arcana Unearthed variant death and dying rules with substantial house rules that ensure less character death but just as much of a brake on level advancement over time for taking damage = hp +10; - have announced intent in next campaign to remove additional spells that "take the spotlight off skills", again modelled on MC's and some WOTC designer musings; - apply rigorous connections of cultural and other backgrounds to prestige classes that avoids too much PrC'ing. - add new feats from published sources and routinely do not add many that over-stack or are just "too good" in my view, same for new spells etc. You will find if you look at Monte Cook's Unearthed Arcana that a number of "problematic" spells people have cited don't exist in that setting, a bit of a tip off. I am blessed with players who voluntarily seek comprehensive character development as much as min/max objectives and who knowingly swerve from "power gamer" to "character I want to play". I try to ration what sorts of accomplishments characters reach at different levels so that it would not be before 19+ that plane-spanning threats etc. figure. E.G., one reason I revised "return to temple of elemental evil" and ran it for 15th level was that the scale of threat was such lower level characters should not be the ones dealing with it and even then intended the "worst outcome" to be disasterous on a regional scale and only threaten world on a longer time horizon that other forces could hope to counter. All of that said, find lots of good discussion in this thread identifying issues to address if you want to "take adventures out of dungeon" and don't want to follow the WOTC path of moving high level adventures into plane hopping. [/QUOTE]
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