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D&D DICEMASTERS (Collectible Dice Building Game)
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<blockquote data-quote="Dire Bare" data-source="post: 7665212" data-attributes="member: 18182"><p>While I don't loathe WizKids or have a problem with how they do business, outside of the new D&D Dice Masters I am not a regular customer anymore. In the past, I did collect Mage Knight and HeroClix, although never played in the tournament scene. My issues with WizKids are similar to yours, in that how they manage their lines doesn't match up with what I want. However, I don't think they are bad actors who don't care about their fans or money grubbing capitalists out to squeeze every last drop out of the lucrative tabletop gaming market.</p><p></p><p>My first issue is the fast and furious release schedule they maintain for their games. I can't keep up! I'm a bit of a collector and a completionist, so just a few boosters of the latest HeroClix release wouldn't be enough, I'd have to try and get a full collection. And at my budget level (and storage space level), there is no way I could keep up with the current WizKids game lines that I am interested in, which include HeroClix, Pathfinder Battles, D&D miniatures, D&D Attack Wing, Star Trek Attack Wing, and now Dice Masters. In fact, they have too many cool games for me to keep up with! Dice Masters is their first game in a long time where I don't feel that anxiety.</p><p></p><p>My second issue is with quality of the miniatures they put out. I am not impressed overall with the sculpts, media (bendy plastic), and paintjob of their miniatures. However, I do accept that they don't do a better or worse job than any other prepainted miniature lines from any other company, and that these issues come with the game genre. I used to collect HeroClix, D&D Miniatures (WotC's version), and a few other prepainted miniature lines, but I've reached a point where the quality issues overcome my desire for lazy miniatures!</p><p></p><p>WizKids certainly has a decent list of games they produced and later cancelled, and you've jogged my memory on a few, like MechWarrior. And I do think they have an approach to releasing games that is somewhat scattershot, lots of games, lots of licenses, lots of expansions, not always a tight control over quality . . . hoping to see what sticks with fans. That's a business decision that might keep you from being a customer, but to "loathe" or denigrate the company is taking it a bit too far, IMO. And it's an approach that seems to work for them, as they have been VERY successful in the tabletop market. I don't have a problem with them taking older games like MechWarrior and "clixing" them, I don't have a problem with them canceling game lines that are no longer meeting their goals (Pirates, MechWarrior, Crimson Skies), and I don't really have a problem with how they approach their business, even though it doesn't work for me as a consumer. I don't even have a problem with them coming up with new editions of their games that make playing older releases on the tournament circuit difficult. They don't "score" worse in that category than any other game company, IMO.</p><p></p><p>Comparing WizKids to TSR and WotC is fair enough up to a point. I think it's silly to claim that any of the three companies didn't care about their games or their fans and were simply trying to squeeze out every last cent from the lucrative tabletop gaming market. TSR put out a lot of good games that were fun and folks loved to play, including Dragon Dice and Spellfire. In the end, it turns out they were not a well run company and had a number of problems that led to their demise, including tons of unsold Dragon Dice AND D&D rpg products . . . probably some unsold Spellfire in that warehouse too! Do (or did) any of these companies "lose sight" of their core brand? Perhaps, but that's armchair quarterbacking with the benefit of 20/20 hindsight. It makes perfect sense for TSR back in the day and for WotC now to grow the D&D brand into "sister games" and licensed products to increase profits and brand awareness. Of course, that can be done well or done poorly, TSR did it poorly. Is WotC? Time will tell, but I have confidence that things are alright.</p><p></p><p>WotC has taken a new slower approach with their core game D&D, which while somewhat disappointing to some fans, makes PERFECT sense to me. And they have decided to license out things they previously handled in-house, like the miniatures and board games. Which doesn't bother me at all, as neither line seems to have taken a hit in quality, the only difference being the logos on the back of the boxes. They are also expanding out their licensing to new(ish) areas, like collectible games (Dice Masters), toys, and comics. How this is seen as evidence that they don't care about the RPG itself or that they are "thrashing" about trying to find profit is silly, IMO. Do the Star Wars movies suffer from the sheer amount of licensed product surrounding them? Star Wars has a long history of crappy licensed products alongside the good stuff, but the brand seems to be doing just fine with new movies coming out soon, TV shows, and robust novel and comic lines . . . not to mention the toys. D&D isn't at the level of Star Wars to be sure, but it has that potential if managed right. Perhaps WotC will be able to make that happen, perhaps not, but I don't begrudge them trying.</p><p></p><p>At the end of the day, it doesn't take away from my enjoyment of the game.</p></blockquote><p></p>
[QUOTE="Dire Bare, post: 7665212, member: 18182"] While I don't loathe WizKids or have a problem with how they do business, outside of the new D&D Dice Masters I am not a regular customer anymore. In the past, I did collect Mage Knight and HeroClix, although never played in the tournament scene. My issues with WizKids are similar to yours, in that how they manage their lines doesn't match up with what I want. However, I don't think they are bad actors who don't care about their fans or money grubbing capitalists out to squeeze every last drop out of the lucrative tabletop gaming market. My first issue is the fast and furious release schedule they maintain for their games. I can't keep up! I'm a bit of a collector and a completionist, so just a few boosters of the latest HeroClix release wouldn't be enough, I'd have to try and get a full collection. And at my budget level (and storage space level), there is no way I could keep up with the current WizKids game lines that I am interested in, which include HeroClix, Pathfinder Battles, D&D miniatures, D&D Attack Wing, Star Trek Attack Wing, and now Dice Masters. In fact, they have too many cool games for me to keep up with! Dice Masters is their first game in a long time where I don't feel that anxiety. My second issue is with quality of the miniatures they put out. I am not impressed overall with the sculpts, media (bendy plastic), and paintjob of their miniatures. However, I do accept that they don't do a better or worse job than any other prepainted miniature lines from any other company, and that these issues come with the game genre. I used to collect HeroClix, D&D Miniatures (WotC's version), and a few other prepainted miniature lines, but I've reached a point where the quality issues overcome my desire for lazy miniatures! WizKids certainly has a decent list of games they produced and later cancelled, and you've jogged my memory on a few, like MechWarrior. And I do think they have an approach to releasing games that is somewhat scattershot, lots of games, lots of licenses, lots of expansions, not always a tight control over quality . . . hoping to see what sticks with fans. That's a business decision that might keep you from being a customer, but to "loathe" or denigrate the company is taking it a bit too far, IMO. And it's an approach that seems to work for them, as they have been VERY successful in the tabletop market. I don't have a problem with them taking older games like MechWarrior and "clixing" them, I don't have a problem with them canceling game lines that are no longer meeting their goals (Pirates, MechWarrior, Crimson Skies), and I don't really have a problem with how they approach their business, even though it doesn't work for me as a consumer. I don't even have a problem with them coming up with new editions of their games that make playing older releases on the tournament circuit difficult. They don't "score" worse in that category than any other game company, IMO. Comparing WizKids to TSR and WotC is fair enough up to a point. I think it's silly to claim that any of the three companies didn't care about their games or their fans and were simply trying to squeeze out every last cent from the lucrative tabletop gaming market. TSR put out a lot of good games that were fun and folks loved to play, including Dragon Dice and Spellfire. In the end, it turns out they were not a well run company and had a number of problems that led to their demise, including tons of unsold Dragon Dice AND D&D rpg products . . . probably some unsold Spellfire in that warehouse too! Do (or did) any of these companies "lose sight" of their core brand? Perhaps, but that's armchair quarterbacking with the benefit of 20/20 hindsight. It makes perfect sense for TSR back in the day and for WotC now to grow the D&D brand into "sister games" and licensed products to increase profits and brand awareness. Of course, that can be done well or done poorly, TSR did it poorly. Is WotC? Time will tell, but I have confidence that things are alright. WotC has taken a new slower approach with their core game D&D, which while somewhat disappointing to some fans, makes PERFECT sense to me. And they have decided to license out things they previously handled in-house, like the miniatures and board games. Which doesn't bother me at all, as neither line seems to have taken a hit in quality, the only difference being the logos on the back of the boxes. They are also expanding out their licensing to new(ish) areas, like collectible games (Dice Masters), toys, and comics. How this is seen as evidence that they don't care about the RPG itself or that they are "thrashing" about trying to find profit is silly, IMO. Do the Star Wars movies suffer from the sheer amount of licensed product surrounding them? Star Wars has a long history of crappy licensed products alongside the good stuff, but the brand seems to be doing just fine with new movies coming out soon, TV shows, and robust novel and comic lines . . . not to mention the toys. D&D isn't at the level of Star Wars to be sure, but it has that potential if managed right. Perhaps WotC will be able to make that happen, perhaps not, but I don't begrudge them trying. At the end of the day, it doesn't take away from my enjoyment of the game. [/QUOTE]
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