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D&D Has Never Been Suitable for Generic Fantasy
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<blockquote data-quote="Neonchameleon" data-source="post: 5926734" data-attributes="member: 87792"><p>I disagree. D&D has been defined across the years. What 4e did was <em>translated</em> D&D while keeping most of the core the same (with the exception of the Gygaxo-Vancian magic system and pun-based material components).</p><p> </p><p>In 1974 there was a decent wargaming community. The language used by D&D was that of tabletop wargaming right down to PC movement rates being recorded in <em>inches</em>. D&D has historically used the language of tabletop wargaming because that's what Gygax used.</p><p> </p><p>In 2008 and 2012 the tabletop wargaming scene is dying on its feet - computer games have eaten it alive. D&D is a relatively obscure hobby - with more people recognising the White Mage and Black Mage from FFVII than the Wizard and Cleric roles.</p><p> </p><p>4e was an attempt to keep the fundamentals of D&D largely the same but to translate the framework it was played in from a language that people with a passing aquaintance with tabletop wargames or D&D itself would start to understand to a framework the order of magnitude more people who play WoW (10 million <em>subscribers</em> in 2008) or FFVII (9.8 million copies sold) - lifetime total players (1 session or more) were estimated at 20 million in 2006.</p><p> </p><p></p><p> </p><p>Which itself is highly traditional. Owlbear. Rust-monster.</p><p> </p><p></p><p> </p><p>No. But it's sufficient to show that it wasn't just Arthurian Romance.</p><p> </p><p></p><p> </p><p>And yet you can drift 4e without many contortions. You just ban or restrict the classes that don't fit as the roles are a superset of classes. Magic User, Fighter, Cleric, Thief needs to be bent hard to fit the MU and the Cleric into most worlds (especially with Gygaxo-Vancian casting). But treat the classic party as roles and you can keep only those classes that fit.</p></blockquote><p></p>
[QUOTE="Neonchameleon, post: 5926734, member: 87792"] I disagree. D&D has been defined across the years. What 4e did was [I]translated[/I] D&D while keeping most of the core the same (with the exception of the Gygaxo-Vancian magic system and pun-based material components). In 1974 there was a decent wargaming community. The language used by D&D was that of tabletop wargaming right down to PC movement rates being recorded in [I]inches[/I]. D&D has historically used the language of tabletop wargaming because that's what Gygax used. In 2008 and 2012 the tabletop wargaming scene is dying on its feet - computer games have eaten it alive. D&D is a relatively obscure hobby - with more people recognising the White Mage and Black Mage from FFVII than the Wizard and Cleric roles. 4e was an attempt to keep the fundamentals of D&D largely the same but to translate the framework it was played in from a language that people with a passing aquaintance with tabletop wargames or D&D itself would start to understand to a framework the order of magnitude more people who play WoW (10 million [I]subscribers[/I] in 2008) or FFVII (9.8 million copies sold) - lifetime total players (1 session or more) were estimated at 20 million in 2006. Which itself is highly traditional. Owlbear. Rust-monster. No. But it's sufficient to show that it wasn't just Arthurian Romance. And yet you can drift 4e without many contortions. You just ban or restrict the classes that don't fit as the roles are a superset of classes. Magic User, Fighter, Cleric, Thief needs to be bent hard to fit the MU and the Cleric into most worlds (especially with Gygaxo-Vancian casting). But treat the classic party as roles and you can keep only those classes that fit. [/QUOTE]
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