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The World of Inzeladun/Conan d20 Forum
General Discussion
Danger
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<blockquote data-quote="thormagni" data-source="post: 1470248" data-attributes="member: 13637"><p>Ya, and players have to have a fundamental faith in the DM/GM/referee and his storytelling abilities, i.e. the ability to create that dramatic tension and to allow for an avenue of escape or victory. Bringing in a monster or trap that CAN kill a PC is easy, bringing in one that CAN'T kill them is also easy. Bringing in something that will give them a good battle or good puzzle and ALMOST kill them is difficult.</p><p></p><p>Because without that faith, and if players just believe that the GM is trying to kill them (which I think is a frequent flaw of new GMs) the game becomes either a contest (players vs. GM) or a frustration. </p><p></p><p>I think it becomes a problem in the game, when the players who have no trust in their DM have to overcome an obstacle. If they believe the game is rigged against them, they will have no confidence that there is an in-game solution. But if they believe the game is fundamentally fair and that the GM is committed to providing an enjoyable but tough adventure, players will be persuaded to continue looking for solutions -- an avenue of escape or victory -- rather than just giving up or lashing out in frustration.</p><p></p><p>Players who have faith in their GM may go as far as to invent escapes where none were intended by the GM. I mean, in a GM's plot an inescapable death trap could be the end result when the players botch the adventure so badly that there is no hope of survival. But players that have faith in their GM will continue to fight and struggle and try things until they actually figure out a way to escape. Their faith in the GM is such that they aren't willing to accept defeat, even though that might be what was intended, because they assume that the GM has left them an out if they can just find it. And of course the GM deserving of that faith will allow them to escape if their method is suitably ingenious, thereby further enforcing that faith. It feeds on itself.</p><p></p><p>There are signs that players have no faith in their DM. Arguing about the toughness of the monsters ("We're only first level characters, that is a CR 10 monster at least, there's no way we can beat it."), arguing about the rules ("Well, clearly that mage couldn't cast that spell at his level," or "There is no way that wall has a climb DC that high. It should be DC 20 instead of DC 30") arguing about the setting or the behavior of NPCs ("Well the Knights of the Blue Rose always leave their prisoners with a knife, so they can commit suicide rather than be eaten by fire ants.")</p><p></p><p>Really, it isn't so different than real-life in many ways. When we sit down to pay bills or work out a problem at work or what have you, succesful people approach problems assuming there is a solution to be found, if they just work hard enough at it. We don't know if this is a DC 10, a DC 20 or a DC 35 problem, just that it is something that must be solved if we are to succeed. So maybe succesful people have faith that the world works in a fair, orderly deciperhable way, while unsuccessful people think the world is inherently unfair, haphazard and random.</p><p></p><p>Or maybe I just failed my Knowledge: Philosophy check...</p></blockquote><p></p>
[QUOTE="thormagni, post: 1470248, member: 13637"] Ya, and players have to have a fundamental faith in the DM/GM/referee and his storytelling abilities, i.e. the ability to create that dramatic tension and to allow for an avenue of escape or victory. Bringing in a monster or trap that CAN kill a PC is easy, bringing in one that CAN'T kill them is also easy. Bringing in something that will give them a good battle or good puzzle and ALMOST kill them is difficult. Because without that faith, and if players just believe that the GM is trying to kill them (which I think is a frequent flaw of new GMs) the game becomes either a contest (players vs. GM) or a frustration. I think it becomes a problem in the game, when the players who have no trust in their DM have to overcome an obstacle. If they believe the game is rigged against them, they will have no confidence that there is an in-game solution. But if they believe the game is fundamentally fair and that the GM is committed to providing an enjoyable but tough adventure, players will be persuaded to continue looking for solutions -- an avenue of escape or victory -- rather than just giving up or lashing out in frustration. Players who have faith in their GM may go as far as to invent escapes where none were intended by the GM. I mean, in a GM's plot an inescapable death trap could be the end result when the players botch the adventure so badly that there is no hope of survival. But players that have faith in their GM will continue to fight and struggle and try things until they actually figure out a way to escape. Their faith in the GM is such that they aren't willing to accept defeat, even though that might be what was intended, because they assume that the GM has left them an out if they can just find it. And of course the GM deserving of that faith will allow them to escape if their method is suitably ingenious, thereby further enforcing that faith. It feeds on itself. There are signs that players have no faith in their DM. Arguing about the toughness of the monsters ("We're only first level characters, that is a CR 10 monster at least, there's no way we can beat it."), arguing about the rules ("Well, clearly that mage couldn't cast that spell at his level," or "There is no way that wall has a climb DC that high. It should be DC 20 instead of DC 30") arguing about the setting or the behavior of NPCs ("Well the Knights of the Blue Rose always leave their prisoners with a knife, so they can commit suicide rather than be eaten by fire ants.") Really, it isn't so different than real-life in many ways. When we sit down to pay bills or work out a problem at work or what have you, succesful people approach problems assuming there is a solution to be found, if they just work hard enough at it. We don't know if this is a DC 10, a DC 20 or a DC 35 problem, just that it is something that must be solved if we are to succeed. So maybe succesful people have faith that the world works in a fair, orderly deciperhable way, while unsuccessful people think the world is inherently unfair, haphazard and random. Or maybe I just failed my Knowledge: Philosophy check... [/QUOTE]
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