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<blockquote data-quote="Chaosmancer" data-source="post: 8865276" data-attributes="member: 6801228"><p><em>sigh</em></p><p></p><p></p><p></p><p>I do understand. I understand that damage isn't related to EVERYTHING.</p><p></p><p></p><p></p><p>Showed the math, you said it wasn't real math. There is no equation that says CR X = Hp+Damage+AC+To Hit value. CR X equals balanced (in theory) against four PCS of level X. </p><p></p><p>We know what four PCs of level X (on average) generally look like. They are why CR X has the values it does. Again, multi-equation values. This isn't X=A+B. This is F(X) = X+1/2 x D which relates to the function F(D) = Y/3 - G. And on and on. And some of those things don't have mathematical expressions. Sorry, there is no equation for how to weigh strong saves versus weak saves. There is no mathematical way to measure fire resistance against thunder immunity. They didn't make a massive computer program that runs everything through a perfectly balanced equation to make the game. </p><p></p><p>This "hidden math" is an illusion that you are clinging to in some desperate attempt to prevent discussion about changing the parts of the system that are broken. It doesn't exist. If it did exist, people would have found it. Instead, there is math where math works, and understanding of logic where math doesn't work.</p><p></p><p></p><p></p><p>A PC CAN start that high. Most don't. Also, PC AC is quite difficult to raise. From level 1 to level 12 a monster's to hit value can increase from +3 to +11. That is an 8 pt increase. Without magic items (which the game isn't balanced around) that PC with 17 AC is likely to tap out around 21, a 4 pt difference. </p><p></p><p>Also, you didn't say "higher than normal for monsters" you said "higher than normal". Additionally, you are just making claims, not showing that advantage can't be +4 on average.</p><p></p><p></p><p></p><p><em>sigh</em></p><p></p><p>Really? Fine. Let's take a moment and consider the only question of encumbrance that actually matters. Why are you giving the PCs rewards they cannot carry? </p><p></p><p>Because an 8 strength wizard? To carry all their necessary equipment is a dagger, a wand, a spellbook, and robes. So that is 9 lbs of gear. Even with 60 lbs of food that is 69 lbs and they can carry 120 lbs, so they still have 50lbs of extra space. Encumbrance isn't some quantum math problem of insane difficulty. The only question that actually matters is "why is the DM giving rewards the player's can't carry?" That's it. That's the only point where encumbrance matters.</p><p></p><p></p><p></p><p>And yet, you refused to acknowledge an analysis of one subclass becuase it was "too weak" and demanded another that was "stronger" to prove balance. Must be a small range.</p><p></p><p></p><p></p><p>So, balance is on the individual level, like I said originally. Good talk. Glad you finally agree with me. </p><p></p><p>Again, are we done here? I feel I have adequately proven myself a dozen times despite your repeated "nuh uh"s</p></blockquote><p></p>
[QUOTE="Chaosmancer, post: 8865276, member: 6801228"] [I]sigh[/I] I do understand. I understand that damage isn't related to EVERYTHING. Showed the math, you said it wasn't real math. There is no equation that says CR X = Hp+Damage+AC+To Hit value. CR X equals balanced (in theory) against four PCS of level X. We know what four PCs of level X (on average) generally look like. They are why CR X has the values it does. Again, multi-equation values. This isn't X=A+B. This is F(X) = X+1/2 x D which relates to the function F(D) = Y/3 - G. And on and on. And some of those things don't have mathematical expressions. Sorry, there is no equation for how to weigh strong saves versus weak saves. There is no mathematical way to measure fire resistance against thunder immunity. They didn't make a massive computer program that runs everything through a perfectly balanced equation to make the game. This "hidden math" is an illusion that you are clinging to in some desperate attempt to prevent discussion about changing the parts of the system that are broken. It doesn't exist. If it did exist, people would have found it. Instead, there is math where math works, and understanding of logic where math doesn't work. A PC CAN start that high. Most don't. Also, PC AC is quite difficult to raise. From level 1 to level 12 a monster's to hit value can increase from +3 to +11. That is an 8 pt increase. Without magic items (which the game isn't balanced around) that PC with 17 AC is likely to tap out around 21, a 4 pt difference. Also, you didn't say "higher than normal for monsters" you said "higher than normal". Additionally, you are just making claims, not showing that advantage can't be +4 on average. [I]sigh[/I] Really? Fine. Let's take a moment and consider the only question of encumbrance that actually matters. Why are you giving the PCs rewards they cannot carry? Because an 8 strength wizard? To carry all their necessary equipment is a dagger, a wand, a spellbook, and robes. So that is 9 lbs of gear. Even with 60 lbs of food that is 69 lbs and they can carry 120 lbs, so they still have 50lbs of extra space. Encumbrance isn't some quantum math problem of insane difficulty. The only question that actually matters is "why is the DM giving rewards the player's can't carry?" That's it. That's the only point where encumbrance matters. And yet, you refused to acknowledge an analysis of one subclass becuase it was "too weak" and demanded another that was "stronger" to prove balance. Must be a small range. So, balance is on the individual level, like I said originally. Good talk. Glad you finally agree with me. Again, are we done here? I feel I have adequately proven myself a dozen times despite your repeated "nuh uh"s [/QUOTE]
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