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<blockquote data-quote="I'm A Banana" data-source="post: 6036368" data-attributes="member: 2067"><p>It's worth not conflating magic items as an award under DM control with magic items as a character option under player control. They serve two very different purposes as game rules, even though they overlap in namespace. </p><p></p><p>I'm exclusively talking about treasure. As is the 5e playtest document. There's nothing about FR or Eberron that means that someone will necessarily know what Elyas Perfume does, or what the Sword of Arak is, or anything about any particular magic item. Maybe they can find out (that's what that big Arcana bonus is for!), but there's nothing inherent to any setting that indicates that such random and unpredictable magic items can't exist. Even FR has its lost kingdoms and wild magic. Even Eberron has the Mournland and Dragonshards. It might've mechanized the potion of cure light wounds, but that doesn't mean that every magic item is an industrial product. </p><p></p><p></p><p></p><p>It's actually pretty easy to cut this Gordian knot.</p><p></p><p>If the magic item is intended to <em>define a character</em> (which isn't something I've been talking about, since it differs from treasure), it should be a built-in character option. Perhaps my fighter is blessed by the gods and makes swords capable of bursting into flame or something. That's not a "magic item" in terms of game rules, that's a class feature, or a specialty, or something else character-controlled. In this case, it's part of the character, and shouldn't really rely on the DM to give it out, or encourage the DM to take it away.</p><p></p><p>Otherwise, it's treasure, and the DM can do whatever the heck she wants with it. Hidden secrets, new discoveries, random effects...</p><p></p><p>None of the items introduced in my games are meant to be character-defining, really (though a character could always opt into it, like the barbarian sort of did). I have no qualms about screwing with them however I see fit, since they aren't part of the assumed characters' power. </p><p></p><p>An option for a particular magic item that IS part of the assumed character's power needs to be handled under a different rubrick. And part of that different rubrick would be "not relying on the DM to give it out."</p><p></p><p></p><p></p><p>I think your first sentence is pretty close to its actual intention (since it certainly ain't balance!): to make magic items feel more "special."</p><p></p><p>The issue with it there is that 10 minutes spent cuddling with your magical hammer isn't much of an investment. The ideas [MENTION=61749]Jeff Carlsen[/MENTION] and others have proposed here are awesomely better.</p><p></p><p>I'd argue that if you'd like a mechanic to give a PC an item that is part of their character identity, that this is a different mechanic than treasure, and that you really shouldn't conflate the two, since one is in the PC's hands, and the other is in the DM's hands, and if you try to put them in both places you'll end up with an unsatisfying arm-wrestling match over who gets to "pick" the item. </p><p></p><p>Let treasure be treasure.</p><p></p><p>Let character options be character options.</p><p></p><p>Both of these things can be "magic items," I think. But you won't find them in the same place in the rulebooks.</p></blockquote><p></p>
[QUOTE="I'm A Banana, post: 6036368, member: 2067"] It's worth not conflating magic items as an award under DM control with magic items as a character option under player control. They serve two very different purposes as game rules, even though they overlap in namespace. I'm exclusively talking about treasure. As is the 5e playtest document. There's nothing about FR or Eberron that means that someone will necessarily know what Elyas Perfume does, or what the Sword of Arak is, or anything about any particular magic item. Maybe they can find out (that's what that big Arcana bonus is for!), but there's nothing inherent to any setting that indicates that such random and unpredictable magic items can't exist. Even FR has its lost kingdoms and wild magic. Even Eberron has the Mournland and Dragonshards. It might've mechanized the potion of cure light wounds, but that doesn't mean that every magic item is an industrial product. It's actually pretty easy to cut this Gordian knot. If the magic item is intended to [I]define a character[/I] (which isn't something I've been talking about, since it differs from treasure), it should be a built-in character option. Perhaps my fighter is blessed by the gods and makes swords capable of bursting into flame or something. That's not a "magic item" in terms of game rules, that's a class feature, or a specialty, or something else character-controlled. In this case, it's part of the character, and shouldn't really rely on the DM to give it out, or encourage the DM to take it away. Otherwise, it's treasure, and the DM can do whatever the heck she wants with it. Hidden secrets, new discoveries, random effects... None of the items introduced in my games are meant to be character-defining, really (though a character could always opt into it, like the barbarian sort of did). I have no qualms about screwing with them however I see fit, since they aren't part of the assumed characters' power. An option for a particular magic item that IS part of the assumed character's power needs to be handled under a different rubrick. And part of that different rubrick would be "not relying on the DM to give it out." I think your first sentence is pretty close to its actual intention (since it certainly ain't balance!): to make magic items feel more "special." The issue with it there is that 10 minutes spent cuddling with your magical hammer isn't much of an investment. The ideas [MENTION=61749]Jeff Carlsen[/MENTION] and others have proposed here are awesomely better. I'd argue that if you'd like a mechanic to give a PC an item that is part of their character identity, that this is a different mechanic than treasure, and that you really shouldn't conflate the two, since one is in the PC's hands, and the other is in the DM's hands, and if you try to put them in both places you'll end up with an unsatisfying arm-wrestling match over who gets to "pick" the item. Let treasure be treasure. Let character options be character options. Both of these things can be "magic items," I think. But you won't find them in the same place in the rulebooks. [/QUOTE]
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