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<blockquote data-quote="Chaosmancer" data-source="post: 9056973" data-attributes="member: 6801228"><p>Okay. </p><p></p><p>The discussion was that being fun and reporting that you had fun in a class doesn't mean it was well-designed or balanced. You countered by saying that classes don't need to be balanced because they give different fantasies, and you specifically mentioned the monk. I would think that would be a fairly obvious connection. </p><p></p><p>To replay the conversation precisely, I said "You should be able to have fun without having to say "well, I'd be better off if I was actually casting spells, but I don't care about being effective." " and your response was "<strong><u>And most people do</u></strong>, <strong><u>because playing a Martial is a fundamentally different fantasy</u></strong> <strong><u>that gets satisfied in a fundamentally different way</u></strong> from that of Casters. <strong><u>Its the same underlying reason</u></strong> why a Gish feels different from either one, and why a Paladin, Ranger, <strong><u>or Monk</u></strong> feel different from that. (The common factor being, of course, that they are all different) " </p><p></p><p>And yet, despite being a fundamentally different fantasy than the other classes, that gets satisfied in a fundamentally different way... the monk is often considered poorly designed. So, if I am to accept your position that the fighter isn't poorly designed, because it is fundamentally different... why does that same logic fail in the face of the monk?</p><p></p><p></p><p></p><p></p><p>Worldbreaker Hulk is capable of reading and following logic. You might be thinking of a different Hulk.</p><p></p><p></p><p></p><p>You do realize that I can't answer until you post right? So breaking up every line of post and repeating the question doesn't actually mean anything? And it also reads like you just ignored everything I said to simply repeat your question multiple times.</p><p></p><p></p><p></p><p>And yet, while <em>you </em>are on record about combat magic... so are OTHER people, who have demanded that casters be taken down beyond even where you want them.</p><p></p><p></p><p></p><p>Beowulf survived having his throat ripped out and only died to the venom, he in fact TALKED with his throat ripped out. </p><p></p><p>King Arthur once demolished a castle wall with a single blow of a non-magical club. That seems like a story that would be told about Heracles. </p><p></p><p>Also, let us not forget Cú Chulainn, Diarmuid Ua Duibhne, Gilgamesh, Māui, Arjuna, Turnus, Aeneas and like half of Greek Mythology including Atalanta, Hippolyta and Perseus,</p><p></p><p>And in modern stories we also get Kratos and Mathayus, the Scorpion King who was inspired by Conan.</p></blockquote><p></p>
[QUOTE="Chaosmancer, post: 9056973, member: 6801228"] Okay. The discussion was that being fun and reporting that you had fun in a class doesn't mean it was well-designed or balanced. You countered by saying that classes don't need to be balanced because they give different fantasies, and you specifically mentioned the monk. I would think that would be a fairly obvious connection. To replay the conversation precisely, I said "You should be able to have fun without having to say "well, I'd be better off if I was actually casting spells, but I don't care about being effective." " and your response was "[B][U]And most people do[/U][/B], [B][U]because playing a Martial is a fundamentally different fantasy[/U][/B] [B][U]that gets satisfied in a fundamentally different way[/U][/B] from that of Casters. [B][U]Its the same underlying reason[/U][/B] why a Gish feels different from either one, and why a Paladin, Ranger, [B][U]or Monk[/U][/B] feel different from that. (The common factor being, of course, that they are all different) " And yet, despite being a fundamentally different fantasy than the other classes, that gets satisfied in a fundamentally different way... the monk is often considered poorly designed. So, if I am to accept your position that the fighter isn't poorly designed, because it is fundamentally different... why does that same logic fail in the face of the monk? Worldbreaker Hulk is capable of reading and following logic. You might be thinking of a different Hulk. You do realize that I can't answer until you post right? So breaking up every line of post and repeating the question doesn't actually mean anything? And it also reads like you just ignored everything I said to simply repeat your question multiple times. And yet, while [I]you [/I]are on record about combat magic... so are OTHER people, who have demanded that casters be taken down beyond even where you want them. Beowulf survived having his throat ripped out and only died to the venom, he in fact TALKED with his throat ripped out. King Arthur once demolished a castle wall with a single blow of a non-magical club. That seems like a story that would be told about Heracles. Also, let us not forget Cú Chulainn, Diarmuid Ua Duibhne, Gilgamesh, Māui, Arjuna, Turnus, Aeneas and like half of Greek Mythology including Atalanta, Hippolyta and Perseus, And in modern stories we also get Kratos and Mathayus, the Scorpion King who was inspired by Conan. [/QUOTE]
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