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Don't Lose The Forest For The Trees
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<blockquote data-quote="Jay Verkuilen" data-source="post: 7732730" data-attributes="member: 6873517"><p>Actually I thought Lewpuls called an RPG a puzzle, so it's not his preference necessarily. </p><p></p><p></p><p></p><p>This is an important point. Game vs. puzzle relies on state of information and computational resources, so the definition gets rather blurry. From a <a href="https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Game_theory" target="_blank">game theory</a> standpoint, in many situations there is a best move (called a "best response") although one often doesn't know what it is in a real situation. With enough computational power, chess is indeed a puzzle, because we know that there actually is an optimal play. It's still a game from the human perspective because human players (and for the moment computer players, too). Tic-tac-toe illustrates this. Except for three year olds, it is a not much of a game. With rational players, it always goes to a draw. <a href="https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Rock–paper–scissors" target="_blank">Rochambeau</a> (as opposed to <a href="http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=rHliDE1_Hls" target="_blank">Cartman's manifestly unfair version</a>) is a game because of imperfect players; with optimal players it's just randomness. </p><p></p><p>I will say this, though: I did feel that "puzzle" clarified to me what an RPG is, but...</p><p></p><p></p><p></p><p>I agree about the fact that this language parsing is overkill. <img src="http://www.enworld.org/forum/images/smilies/nervous.png" class="smilie" loading="lazy" alt=":heh:" title="Nervous Laugh :heh:" data-shortname=":heh:" /></p></blockquote><p></p>
[QUOTE="Jay Verkuilen, post: 7732730, member: 6873517"] Actually I thought Lewpuls called an RPG a puzzle, so it's not his preference necessarily. This is an important point. Game vs. puzzle relies on state of information and computational resources, so the definition gets rather blurry. From a [URL="https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Game_theory"]game theory[/URL] standpoint, in many situations there is a best move (called a "best response") although one often doesn't know what it is in a real situation. With enough computational power, chess is indeed a puzzle, because we know that there actually is an optimal play. It's still a game from the human perspective because human players (and for the moment computer players, too). Tic-tac-toe illustrates this. Except for three year olds, it is a not much of a game. With rational players, it always goes to a draw. [URL="https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Rock–paper–scissors"]Rochambeau[/URL] (as opposed to [URL="http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=rHliDE1_Hls"]Cartman's manifestly unfair version[/URL]) is a game because of imperfect players; with optimal players it's just randomness. I will say this, though: I did feel that "puzzle" clarified to me what an RPG is, but... I agree about the fact that this language parsing is overkill. :heh: [/QUOTE]
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