Dust Of Sneezing And Choking

[Thundering_Dragon]

In my campaign I allow players to buy anything in the books they have access to. I never thought the biggest problem with this would come from the core rules. I may just ban all cursed items from the list of what you can purchase now, but, this is the item that I have serious problems with. The ability damage is not even a difficulty, it's the fact it stuns for 5d4 rounds with no save that destroyed a high level NPC for whom I had worked up an entire history and plots around, by ONE PC who was five levels below him. What is the justification for this items existence and price?

Even if used by the DM it would result in a TPK, so I don't see the logic in it being there just for DMs, either.

 

[Infiniti2000]

Whoa. I suggest you just delete the first three sentences from your post. You will likely not get good responses. I almost want to respond, "You get what you deserve."

One mitigating factor is that the PC who uses this item is also subject to its effects, as well as anyone else in the area.

 

[HellHound]

After running into this being used as a weapon in Rappan Athuk, I ruled that it is a -cursed- item, and anyone trying to use it is the one who suffers for it.

Try to throw it? It explodes in your hand.

I've still seen it used to good effect by the flying sorcerer who flew in, triggered it, and crashed to the ground coughing and choking, along with the villain. I've also randomized the spread size, so it can't reliably be used in an environment where your team mates are just out of the area of effect, or used to reliably incapacitate a large number of opponents. (1d6: 1 - self only, 2 - 5ft spread, 3 - 10 ft spread, 4 - 15 ft spread, 5 - 20 ft spread, 6 - 30 ft spread)

 

[ARandomGod]

The ability damage is not even a difficulty, it's the fact it stuns for 5d4 rounds with no save that destroyed a high level NPC for whom I had worked up an entire history and plots around, by ONE PC who was five levels below him. What is the justification for this items existence and price?

Way ahead of you. I had a player the other day looking at cursed items (I knew what he was looking at!) I stopped him right there and told him that "cursed items can only be found, not made or bought".

Especially that one. The price is how much it sells for to vendors, who will reluctantly pay that much for it (and the secretely keep it for themselves. It's incredibly effective!).

You should definitely make a de facto (GM) ruling that no cursed items can ever be (knowingly)* bought by a PC. Because even with Hellhound's ruling there (and interesting and fun looking one BTW) the item is still worth the price occasionally as a sacrifice piece.


*Be sure you throw in that (knowingly) under your breath, just for fun.

 

[NPC]

This is especially painful for a DM if your PCs wielding the dust are wearing necklaces of adaption. :|

 

[Rassilon]

Thundering Dragon, would an out of game 'understanding' work for your group ?

We had a very similar issue with the 3.0 bracelet of friends, which as long as you knew who your enemy was, you could keep using until they failed a saving throw and teleported into the middle of your buffed group.
Just say that you waited to 3:00 am to give it a reasonable chance that the enemy would teleport in asleep, armed with a night shirt!

We, seeing a relation to MAD and cold war deterrent theory, used it exactly Once.

We technically still have the item, and anyone could make them, but the item just isn't mentioned, and though there has been no DM ruling that they don't exist, the item is 'forgotten'.

This understanding has much the same effect as a DM elimination of the item, but may be more palatable to your group if they would resent you changing your mind on "all items available", and avoids any logic problems with leaving the item in (ie: why doesn't everyone use this to kill their enemies ?)

Rassilon.

 

[moritheil]

In my campaign I allow players to buy anything in the books they have access to. I never thought the biggest problem with this would come from the core rules. I may just ban all cursed items from the list of what you can purchase now, but, this is the item that I have serious problems with. The ability damage is not even a difficulty, it's the fact it stuns for 5d4 rounds with no save that destroyed a high level NPC for whom I had worked up an entire history and plots around, by ONE PC who was five levels below him. What is the justification for this items existence and price?

Even if used by the DM it would result in a TPK, so I don't see the logic in it being there just for DMs, either.

I don't want to make light of your situation, but on these boards, that's considered a really obvious problem that everyone's known about for months. Try to take Inf's reply in context; it's beyond old news here.

ARG's answer is a pretty good one - don't allow your players to deliberately make or buy items they know to be cursed.

Rassilon touches upon the power balance that should exist in every group. For example, my players don't abuse Improved Sunder, because they are acutely aware that Improved Sunder can be used against them as well. The problem you encountered could well be described as "metagaming." (How did everyone know this powder was cursed? How did they know exactly what it did? How did they know that necklaces of adaption, and those specifically, were needed to escape the effects? Did they make knowledge checks and checks to convince each other?)

If the players are going to metagame, that tempts the DM to metagame, and when the DM metagames, all hell breaks loose. Remember, if a party throws trash at the DM, the DM can always come up with better trash to throw back. Armies of rust monsters, hulking hurler tarrasques, etc. are but a fraction of the DM's arsenal.