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Evaluating the warlord-y Fighter
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<blockquote data-quote="koga305" data-source="post: 6489053" data-attributes="member: 6747640"><p>Wow, that's a harsh critique. I disagree with you, however, in that I don't think my dissatisfaction in playing a Cleric as a nonmagical Warlord comes from an enlarged ego. I think most players (including myself) are quite willing to pick effects that are on-theme but less powerful. For example, I'd willingly play a Beast Master ranger (which seems rather underpowered to most) in order to have a beast companion - while the Hunter is cool too, I really like the idea of having a trained eagle even if it's not the most powerful in battle, and I can still get the Help action every turn from it at level 7 which is pretty sweet.</p><p></p><p>However, I think the reflavoring problem for the Cleric comes from the Cleric's powers being an ill fit for the Warlord class. If I'm justifying my Turn Undead as a special intimidation ability that (for some reason) only works on undead, or curing poison instantly with <em>lesser restoration</em> as a special healing technique, or <em>spiritual weapon</em> as really being an ally's extra attacks even when I'm rolling the dice, eventually things start to feel pretty awkward. And yes, you <em>can</em> ignore the stuff that doesn't quite fit, but at that point it's less "ignoring some options" and more "you're not playing half the class." And there's still no good way to reposition allies on the battlefield or give extra attacks to another player, both of which the Battlemaster fighter (like the 4E Warlord) can actually do. The Bard might be a better fit, but there's a similar problem - some abilities like Countercharm and many of the spells are kind of <em>weird</em> for a purely martial character to have access to, and ignoring them means you're missing out on a ton of what the class has to offer.</p><p></p><p>5E is pretty great about making characters of all power levels fun to play along with each other, but it does assume that every character is making use of the abilities available to them. Imagine if you played a low-level Fighter, but simply chose not to use Second Wind or Action Surge, or a Rogue that never used Sneak Attack. You'd feel pretty overshadowed in combat compared to a baseline Barbarian that was Raging every few fights, or a Dragon Sorcerer blasting away with the occasional Burning Hands and Chromatic Orb. It's not just about ego - it's about feeling like you're contributing effectively to the party.</p></blockquote><p></p>
[QUOTE="koga305, post: 6489053, member: 6747640"] Wow, that's a harsh critique. I disagree with you, however, in that I don't think my dissatisfaction in playing a Cleric as a nonmagical Warlord comes from an enlarged ego. I think most players (including myself) are quite willing to pick effects that are on-theme but less powerful. For example, I'd willingly play a Beast Master ranger (which seems rather underpowered to most) in order to have a beast companion - while the Hunter is cool too, I really like the idea of having a trained eagle even if it's not the most powerful in battle, and I can still get the Help action every turn from it at level 7 which is pretty sweet. However, I think the reflavoring problem for the Cleric comes from the Cleric's powers being an ill fit for the Warlord class. If I'm justifying my Turn Undead as a special intimidation ability that (for some reason) only works on undead, or curing poison instantly with [I]lesser restoration[/I] as a special healing technique, or [I]spiritual weapon[/I] as really being an ally's extra attacks even when I'm rolling the dice, eventually things start to feel pretty awkward. And yes, you [I]can[/I] ignore the stuff that doesn't quite fit, but at that point it's less "ignoring some options" and more "you're not playing half the class." And there's still no good way to reposition allies on the battlefield or give extra attacks to another player, both of which the Battlemaster fighter (like the 4E Warlord) can actually do. The Bard might be a better fit, but there's a similar problem - some abilities like Countercharm and many of the spells are kind of [I]weird[/I] for a purely martial character to have access to, and ignoring them means you're missing out on a ton of what the class has to offer. 5E is pretty great about making characters of all power levels fun to play along with each other, but it does assume that every character is making use of the abilities available to them. Imagine if you played a low-level Fighter, but simply chose not to use Second Wind or Action Surge, or a Rogue that never used Sneak Attack. You'd feel pretty overshadowed in combat compared to a baseline Barbarian that was Raging every few fights, or a Dragon Sorcerer blasting away with the occasional Burning Hands and Chromatic Orb. It's not just about ego - it's about feeling like you're contributing effectively to the party. [/QUOTE]
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