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General Tabletop Discussion
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Evil Monster Ancestries - Yay or Nay?
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<blockquote data-quote="Clint_L" data-source="post: 9287121" data-attributes="member: 7035894"><p>I think alignment is an incoherent concept, and the alignment wheel in particular makes no sense. Good and evil are not objective things, they are subjective value statements. For example, Gary Gygax saw lawful good as compatible with actions that I personal consider abhorrent. Therefore, I wouldn't put Joker on an alignment wheel; I don't think doing so adds anything to understanding his character or motivations.</p><p></p><p>So since I don't do alignment, there's no such thing as "evil" monsters or species. There are just things with motivations, some of are in conflict with others. Beings are defined by their actions. Therefore, ancestry is irrelevant to how you choose to play your character.</p><p></p><p>That doesn't mean there aren't different outlooks, philosophies, motivations, etc. For example, fiends aren't evil in my world (evil doesn't exist) but they generally (not always) have motivations and desires that are very incompatible with most terrestrial creatures. But that's largely true of celestials as well, though in different ways. And then there are creatures whose existence is basically an automatic problem for others, such as vampires and so on. So there is plenty of conflict.</p><p></p><p>Edit: this is true for me across all games, not just fantasy ones. For instance, even when I'm preparing a Dread scenario, I'm still trying to think of why the antagonists do what they do - what is their objective? This helps me play them a lot better than if they are just "evil". But that's just how my mind works; there's no right or wrong here. The upshot is that I sidestep the problem the OP describes.</p></blockquote><p></p>
[QUOTE="Clint_L, post: 9287121, member: 7035894"] I think alignment is an incoherent concept, and the alignment wheel in particular makes no sense. Good and evil are not objective things, they are subjective value statements. For example, Gary Gygax saw lawful good as compatible with actions that I personal consider abhorrent. Therefore, I wouldn't put Joker on an alignment wheel; I don't think doing so adds anything to understanding his character or motivations. So since I don't do alignment, there's no such thing as "evil" monsters or species. There are just things with motivations, some of are in conflict with others. Beings are defined by their actions. Therefore, ancestry is irrelevant to how you choose to play your character. That doesn't mean there aren't different outlooks, philosophies, motivations, etc. For example, fiends aren't evil in my world (evil doesn't exist) but they generally (not always) have motivations and desires that are very incompatible with most terrestrial creatures. But that's largely true of celestials as well, though in different ways. And then there are creatures whose existence is basically an automatic problem for others, such as vampires and so on. So there is plenty of conflict. Edit: this is true for me across all games, not just fantasy ones. For instance, even when I'm preparing a Dread scenario, I'm still trying to think of why the antagonists do what they do - what is their objective? This helps me play them a lot better than if they are just "evil". But that's just how my mind works; there's no right or wrong here. The upshot is that I sidestep the problem the OP describes. [/QUOTE]
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