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Failing saves is...ok?
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<blockquote data-quote="Tony Vargas" data-source="post: 7200222" data-attributes="member: 996"><p>Another angle to look at this from is BA. 5e BA likes to assume that a character can likely get by without much investment in a given check. The guy who never gets proficiency in a skill that uses the 8 from his standard array that he never used any ASIs on is -1, but a lot of checks that might still be useful to the party aren't going to be that high-DC 10s & 13s & 15s and the like - even if the party is facing a higher DC that he can't touch, he can use the Help action.</p><p></p><p>In combat, when it comes to attacking, all your attacks are likely to key of your best - maybe, your second-best - attribute, and gain proficiency. You cantrip and spell attacks will use your caster stat every time, and you'll generally manage to pick up a weapon you're proficient in, and, if you use weapons at all, will have invested in some STR or DEX (just one or the other).</p><p></p><p>Similarly, AC is not likely to be too horrid, almost everyone gets some armor proficiency and/or makes some investment in DEX (which can also double as your attacks stat with weapons), or can cast mage armor or whatever. </p><p></p><p>Monsters will tend to have comparable attacks and decent ACs, too. </p><p></p><p>DCs you impose are, like attacks, generally based on your best stat and always include proficiency, ranging from 13 to 19 over 20 levels. The DCs you're likely to face also are around that range, some might be even lower at the low end. </p><p></p><p>All pretty consistent. Then you get to save bonuses. Instead of having one AC that everyone keeps up fairly easily as a matter of course with armor & such adding to it, you need to cover 6 saves, one based on each stat, with just stat bonus & proficiency - and you only get proficiency on two of them. </p><p></p><p>So you end up, some of the time, facing DCs based on max-stat-plus-proficiency, with a bonus based on dump-stat-plus-nada. There's no "I'm helping" option like there is when you're all making out of combat checks, there's no bowing out until the next time your good save comes up. You get hit with something that forces the save, there's not a lot of alternatives.</p></blockquote><p></p>
[QUOTE="Tony Vargas, post: 7200222, member: 996"] Another angle to look at this from is BA. 5e BA likes to assume that a character can likely get by without much investment in a given check. The guy who never gets proficiency in a skill that uses the 8 from his standard array that he never used any ASIs on is -1, but a lot of checks that might still be useful to the party aren't going to be that high-DC 10s & 13s & 15s and the like - even if the party is facing a higher DC that he can't touch, he can use the Help action. In combat, when it comes to attacking, all your attacks are likely to key of your best - maybe, your second-best - attribute, and gain proficiency. You cantrip and spell attacks will use your caster stat every time, and you'll generally manage to pick up a weapon you're proficient in, and, if you use weapons at all, will have invested in some STR or DEX (just one or the other). Similarly, AC is not likely to be too horrid, almost everyone gets some armor proficiency and/or makes some investment in DEX (which can also double as your attacks stat with weapons), or can cast mage armor or whatever. Monsters will tend to have comparable attacks and decent ACs, too. DCs you impose are, like attacks, generally based on your best stat and always include proficiency, ranging from 13 to 19 over 20 levels. The DCs you're likely to face also are around that range, some might be even lower at the low end. All pretty consistent. Then you get to save bonuses. Instead of having one AC that everyone keeps up fairly easily as a matter of course with armor & such adding to it, you need to cover 6 saves, one based on each stat, with just stat bonus & proficiency - and you only get proficiency on two of them. So you end up, some of the time, facing DCs based on max-stat-plus-proficiency, with a bonus based on dump-stat-plus-nada. There's no "I'm helping" option like there is when you're all making out of combat checks, there's no bowing out until the next time your good save comes up. You get hit with something that forces the save, there's not a lot of alternatives. [/QUOTE]
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