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Feats, don't fail me now! - feat design in 5e
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<blockquote data-quote="Patryn of Elvenshae" data-source="post: 6022585" data-attributes="member: 23094"><p>No, I'm not.</p><p></p><p>I'm saying that the rules should silo abilities such that every character has something to bring to the table in each of the three main pillars.</p><p></p><p>I'm saying that, currently, the playtest fighter is bad because it doesn't offer enough in the noncombat pillars.</p><p></p><p>I'm saying that you need to elevate noncombat rules to the same importance as combat rules and then, at least in the base rules, not let characters actively suck in any of the areas.</p><p></p><p>You are, in fact, reading me as the complete opposite of what I am saying. Just like you should not be able to build a completely combat-useless character, you should not be able to build a completely social-useless character.</p><p></p><p>[EDIT: The player, of course, can always choose to employ that character's abilities in unoptimal or ineffective ways, or to simply ignore them, but by the rules they should be there.]</p><p></p><p></p><p></p><p>Yes, they were. They were in 3.XE, they were in 2E, they were in 1E, and they were in Rules Cycolpedia. The fact that many people continue to be obstinately wrong does not, suddenly, make them right.</p><p></p><p></p><p></p><p>Then use the NPC rules.</p><p></p><p></p><p></p><p>And, presumably, you base your RP of that character on the way in which the player has been playing them? So, if John has been playing Eralth the Wise as a combat-incapable or combat-avoiding character, you don't suddenly have them charge headfirst into conflicts?</p><p></p><p>Or do absent PCs have sudden, inexplicable personality changes?</p><p></p><p></p><p></p><p>Then might I suggest that 5E, which aims to be inclusive of <strong>D&D</strong>, not anything and everything, will likely continue to be a problem for you?</p><p></p><p></p><p></p><p>I think, as stated above, that those two pillars absolutely need more support. And, IMO, the best way to support them is through siloed character abilities, such that you cannot, to any great degree, trade off combat effectiveness for social effectiveness - <strong>or vice versa</strong>.</p><p></p><p>That way, all players will be able to meaningfully participate in all of the pillars, and social interaction encounters do not become a 1-on-1 conversation between the DM and the party "face."</p></blockquote><p></p>
[QUOTE="Patryn of Elvenshae, post: 6022585, member: 23094"] No, I'm not. I'm saying that the rules should silo abilities such that every character has something to bring to the table in each of the three main pillars. I'm saying that, currently, the playtest fighter is bad because it doesn't offer enough in the noncombat pillars. I'm saying that you need to elevate noncombat rules to the same importance as combat rules and then, at least in the base rules, not let characters actively suck in any of the areas. You are, in fact, reading me as the complete opposite of what I am saying. Just like you should not be able to build a completely combat-useless character, you should not be able to build a completely social-useless character. [EDIT: The player, of course, can always choose to employ that character's abilities in unoptimal or ineffective ways, or to simply ignore them, but by the rules they should be there.] Yes, they were. They were in 3.XE, they were in 2E, they were in 1E, and they were in Rules Cycolpedia. The fact that many people continue to be obstinately wrong does not, suddenly, make them right. Then use the NPC rules. And, presumably, you base your RP of that character on the way in which the player has been playing them? So, if John has been playing Eralth the Wise as a combat-incapable or combat-avoiding character, you don't suddenly have them charge headfirst into conflicts? Or do absent PCs have sudden, inexplicable personality changes? Then might I suggest that 5E, which aims to be inclusive of [b]D&D[/b], not anything and everything, will likely continue to be a problem for you? I think, as stated above, that those two pillars absolutely need more support. And, IMO, the best way to support them is through siloed character abilities, such that you cannot, to any great degree, trade off combat effectiveness for social effectiveness - [b]or vice versa[/b]. That way, all players will be able to meaningfully participate in all of the pillars, and social interaction encounters do not become a 1-on-1 conversation between the DM and the party "face." [/QUOTE]
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