Fighting With Spears

[malien]

A friend of mine is starting up a new campaign, and suddenly, it occurs to me; never, not once, since the old days of playing 2nd edition, have I seen anyone in our gaming group play a fighter that focused more on spears (both the long and short versions). Everybody uses a sword, or an axe, or a mace... never a spear.

And yet, spears are cool. So, I ask you, my fellow ENWorlders. Any suggestions on feats and the like for a character that is going to make use of spears? Are they good? Are they bad?

Though, I do suddenly realize that my concept 'fighter who uses spears' is pretty... threadbare...

 

[Mouseferatu]

I agree, spears got the shaft--pun fully intended--in D&D. There's a reason they were so common historically, and it's not just because they were cheap and easy to make (though that's part of it, of course).

Reach is, of course, the spear's main advantage, but trying to include that more than it already is would complicate the combat system. So I have two suggestions:

Edit: Remainder of post removed. I don't mean to be cryptic, but I'll either replace it, or explain why I removed it, in a day or two.

 

[Kobold Stew]

Mouseferatu's ideas on this seem really good to me.

Level, balanced.

cool.

 

[malien]

Hmm, I like the ideas, Mouseferatu. But, what about things that are already in the rules somewhere? I admit, my gaming group is all about using things in printed products, and our adventurous nature extends about as far as thinking about buying Frostburn.

So, unfortunately, 3rd party products are pretty much out for me... and home-brewed ideas are more likely to be shot down than not, simply because they're not in print.

Anything in the books already that can be put to use? Any PrCs, or anything? I should hope, at least, that Complete Warrior has /something/...? (I'd just have to dig it out, and I'm too tired at this hour!)

 

[Kabol]

Theres a Feat in FR: Unaproachable East - Called Long Reach - It allows you to add 5 more feet of reach to A spear , and only a spear. Its really a Fantasic feat

 

[malien]

Oh... ah... Should've mentioned my group seems to have an allergic reaction with most everything printed with Forgotten Realms on it...

... something about Ed Greenwood and Elminster the biggest twink ever... I don't know...

 

[Mouseferatu]

Hmm, I like the ideas, Mouseferatu. But, what about things that are already in the rules somewhere? I admit, my gaming group is all about using things in printed products, and our adventurous nature extends about as far as thinking about buying Frostburn.

So, unfortunately, 3rd party products are pretty much out for me... and home-brewed ideas are more likely to be shot down than not, simply because they're not in print.

Anything in the books already that can be put to use? Any PrCs, or anything? I should hope, at least, that Complete Warrior has /something/...? (I'd just have to dig it out, and I'm too tired at this hour!)

Well, if it was already in the rules, I wouldn't have to homebrew it.

Seriously, I don't know of anything like what you're looking for, but it may be out there.

If it helps convince your group to go with the homebrew ideas, you can tell them they came from someone who's worked with D20 for years, has appeared in Dragon, and is just now wrapping up his first WotC contract. I can't imagine why it would matter--a good idea is a good idea, no matter where it comes from--but if they're really that finicky about what they use, maybe it'll help. :\

 

[Darklone]

Get that greatspear (CW?) with 2d6... it's a real fun weapon.

Combat Reflexes rock, Hold the line is pretty good, Imp Trip/Disarm (depending on the polearm) are nice, Dodge-Mob-SpringAttack are a must have.

Don't use Enlarge Person too often, you won't be able to 5ft back and full attack. Get cross class skills in tumble.

 

[Plane Sailing]

1) Allow a "Choke Up" type feat that allows the wielder to change his grip when using a reach weapon such as a longspear or pole arm, and thus use it to attack people 5' away. That suddenly makes reach weapons a lot more attractive, but doesn't really overbalance anything.

Already use this one IMC. At a stroke it makes spiked chain an interesting choice rather than an uber-weapon

2) An optional rule I'm using in an upcoming product. You know how certain weapons are martial or exotic, based on how you use them? A bastard sword is a martial weapon when used two-handed, but you can use it one-handed as an exotic? Treat spears the same way, but one category lower. If you've got simple proficiency, you fight with them two handed. If you have martial, however, you can fight with a spear one-handed

An excellent idea that I've not come across before but I'll certainly see about introducing. Very nice indeed.

A third option that I'm considering for my game but which I haven't actually playtested yet (so caveat emptor) is this:

Spears are *always* considered readied against a charge. i.e. if anything charges someone who is wielding a spear, the spear automatically gets the double damage bonus. A small and flavourfull boost which is likely to reduce the number of PCs charging willy-nilly into spearwalls.

Cheers

 

[Lord Pendragon]

I agree, spears got the shaft--pun fully intended--in D&D. There's a reason they were so common historically, and it's not just because they were cheap and easy to make (though that's part of it, of course).

AFAIK, one of the largest reasons for this, other than the cost, was that they are comparatively easy to use.

Call me the lone voice of dissent on this one, but I don't really think a spear should be the equivalent of a longsword. It's an inferior weapon. Even in D&D terms, not all weapons are created equal. As a DM, I'd allow feats to improve the spear, since they represent technique and training. But I doubt I'd ever go with "spears are always set against a charge" or the choke-up idea (without requiring a feat to do so).