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[Forgotten Realms] The Wall of the Faithless
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<blockquote data-quote="Hussar" data-source="post: 6787140" data-attributes="member: 22779"><p>Because without that common baseline, we're just not speaking the same language. No one is saying that it "must" work a certain way. What's being said is that the Wall <em>has been</em> presented a certain way.</p><p></p><p>If I say Lolth is a force of good for the Elves and is all about promoting peace and harmony, that could be 100% true in my home game. Maybe I've repurposed Drow and changed their flavour. My Drow are still matriarchal but are now a force of good in the world, using their knowledge and magic to protect the world from the evil, dastardly gnomes that want to burrow up through the floors and eat your children.</p><p></p><p>I certainly could say that. But, if I go into a conversation about Forgotten Realms that is talking about Lolth and I try to claim this as anything more than my home-brew version of Lolth, i'd be rightly laughed out of the thread. That is not how Lolth has ever been presented, there is no evidence to support my version of Lolth and my version of Lolth runs contrary to every representation of Lolth in the game. Sure, it might be an interesting concept, but, we're not talking about my home game. </p><p></p><p>Or your home game. </p><p></p><p>Or Bob's home game.</p><p></p><p>We're talking about how the material has been presented to the public and trying to reconcile that presentation with other material. Since we're talking about 5e, then using other editions flavour is problematic at best. But, then again, we SHOULD establish that baseline. Earlier in this thread, people talked about using Planescape material (I forget the name of the book) to talk about how souls are dealt with in D&D. So, are we talking about Forgotten Realms or Forgotten Realms plus Planescape? If it's the latter, then I have nothing to add to the conversation because I have little or no knowledge of Planescape. </p><p></p><p>Recognising the baseline of the conversation is key to being able to contribute anything of value to the conversation. Without that baseline understanding, we're just talking past each other. Does it matter if the Fugue Plane is in Hades, or the Astral Sea or the Astral Plane? I honestly don't know. I don't think it does, but, if it actually does, then that should get established. Are we using Dieties and Demigods gods or Forgotten Realms gods? After all, DDG gods are not powered by faith - they just are. Which makes the Wall completely superfluous and, really, downright nasty. OTOH, in FR, gods are powered by faith, meaning that the Faithless are actually actively harming the gods. Stuffing them in the Wall does make some logical sense then. Not for punishment so much at deterence and also to prevent the Faithless souls from becoming demon food or devil fodder.</p><p></p><p>So, what, exactly, are we talking about?</p></blockquote><p></p>
[QUOTE="Hussar, post: 6787140, member: 22779"] Because without that common baseline, we're just not speaking the same language. No one is saying that it "must" work a certain way. What's being said is that the Wall [I]has been[/I] presented a certain way. If I say Lolth is a force of good for the Elves and is all about promoting peace and harmony, that could be 100% true in my home game. Maybe I've repurposed Drow and changed their flavour. My Drow are still matriarchal but are now a force of good in the world, using their knowledge and magic to protect the world from the evil, dastardly gnomes that want to burrow up through the floors and eat your children. I certainly could say that. But, if I go into a conversation about Forgotten Realms that is talking about Lolth and I try to claim this as anything more than my home-brew version of Lolth, i'd be rightly laughed out of the thread. That is not how Lolth has ever been presented, there is no evidence to support my version of Lolth and my version of Lolth runs contrary to every representation of Lolth in the game. Sure, it might be an interesting concept, but, we're not talking about my home game. Or your home game. Or Bob's home game. We're talking about how the material has been presented to the public and trying to reconcile that presentation with other material. Since we're talking about 5e, then using other editions flavour is problematic at best. But, then again, we SHOULD establish that baseline. Earlier in this thread, people talked about using Planescape material (I forget the name of the book) to talk about how souls are dealt with in D&D. So, are we talking about Forgotten Realms or Forgotten Realms plus Planescape? If it's the latter, then I have nothing to add to the conversation because I have little or no knowledge of Planescape. Recognising the baseline of the conversation is key to being able to contribute anything of value to the conversation. Without that baseline understanding, we're just talking past each other. Does it matter if the Fugue Plane is in Hades, or the Astral Sea or the Astral Plane? I honestly don't know. I don't think it does, but, if it actually does, then that should get established. Are we using Dieties and Demigods gods or Forgotten Realms gods? After all, DDG gods are not powered by faith - they just are. Which makes the Wall completely superfluous and, really, downright nasty. OTOH, in FR, gods are powered by faith, meaning that the Faithless are actually actively harming the gods. Stuffing them in the Wall does make some logical sense then. Not for punishment so much at deterence and also to prevent the Faithless souls from becoming demon food or devil fodder. So, what, exactly, are we talking about? [/QUOTE]
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