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Forked Thread: I hate game balance! (How elves wrecked the wizard and game balance)
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<blockquote data-quote="Edena_of_Neith" data-source="post: 4338784" data-attributes="member: 2020"><p>(rueful look)</p><p></p><p> I am Guilty As Charged. But then, so was almost everyone back then. Everyone seemed to love elven multiclass characters. We had elves coming out of our ears back then. Yeah, we did.</p><p></p><p> Gary Gygax (*May His Memory Always Be Honored*) created a specific system, where wizards worked in X way, fighters in Y way. It was possible to adapt this system to specific settings, such as Hyboria (Conan), but it took work. (You didn't see wizards, as a general rule, running around using the Vancian magic system in Hyboria, obviously, so some modification was needed.)</p><p></p><p> He created level limits. Very severe at first, as noted for OD&D (6 for fighter, 8 for wizard.)</p><p> He upped the limits in 1E to 7 and 9 (9 and 11 with great stats.)</p><p> Then, he upped the limits again in 1E Unearthed Arcana (to 10 and 15, I think ...)</p><p></p><p> And yeah, we sorta got rid of those level limits. LOL. Guilty as Charged. Me and all my compatriots. Elves were fun. Elves ruled. Elven multiclass characters had it all. </p><p> Everyone did it. Everyone. Nobody wanted to be stuck with level limits. Even Gygax bowed to the pressure, and upped the limits.</p><p></p><p> And heck, in 2E, they allowed for Slow Advancement and Elven High Magic, which was a big step forward for the elves and their power level. So now, you could Officially have an elven archmage of 18th level, and High Magic to boot.</p><p></p><p> So yeah, we ignored the rules meant to balance the game, and of course the game became unbalanced. And that, produced that glut of high level wizards - and Gary Gygax never intended such a glut - who threw around high powered spells (and better yet, Elven High Magic) and that further unbalanced things.</p><p></p><p> Heh. You know what should have happened?</p><p> Yamara, of all comics, got it right. The drow should have gotten tired of all this elven goodness, and led by Yocchi (sp?) should have come up and conquered the surface.</p><p> No more elves! </p><p> Do as the nice drow tell you ... or be their next sacrifice to Lolth. (and guys, remember that drow females ARE bigger, stronger, smarter, wiser, and higher in charisma than drow males. It's right there in 1E. What to do? Put on that cursed Girdle of Femininity, quick!)</p></blockquote><p></p>
[QUOTE="Edena_of_Neith, post: 4338784, member: 2020"] (rueful look) I am Guilty As Charged. But then, so was almost everyone back then. Everyone seemed to love elven multiclass characters. We had elves coming out of our ears back then. Yeah, we did. Gary Gygax (*May His Memory Always Be Honored*) created a specific system, where wizards worked in X way, fighters in Y way. It was possible to adapt this system to specific settings, such as Hyboria (Conan), but it took work. (You didn't see wizards, as a general rule, running around using the Vancian magic system in Hyboria, obviously, so some modification was needed.) He created level limits. Very severe at first, as noted for OD&D (6 for fighter, 8 for wizard.) He upped the limits in 1E to 7 and 9 (9 and 11 with great stats.) Then, he upped the limits again in 1E Unearthed Arcana (to 10 and 15, I think ...) And yeah, we sorta got rid of those level limits. LOL. Guilty as Charged. Me and all my compatriots. Elves were fun. Elves ruled. Elven multiclass characters had it all. Everyone did it. Everyone. Nobody wanted to be stuck with level limits. Even Gygax bowed to the pressure, and upped the limits. And heck, in 2E, they allowed for Slow Advancement and Elven High Magic, which was a big step forward for the elves and their power level. So now, you could Officially have an elven archmage of 18th level, and High Magic to boot. So yeah, we ignored the rules meant to balance the game, and of course the game became unbalanced. And that, produced that glut of high level wizards - and Gary Gygax never intended such a glut - who threw around high powered spells (and better yet, Elven High Magic) and that further unbalanced things. Heh. You know what should have happened? Yamara, of all comics, got it right. The drow should have gotten tired of all this elven goodness, and led by Yocchi (sp?) should have come up and conquered the surface. No more elves! Do as the nice drow tell you ... or be their next sacrifice to Lolth. (and guys, remember that drow females ARE bigger, stronger, smarter, wiser, and higher in charisma than drow males. It's right there in 1E. What to do? Put on that cursed Girdle of Femininity, quick!) [/QUOTE]
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Forked Thread: I hate game balance! (How elves wrecked the wizard and game balance)
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