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Guardians of the Galaxy Volume 3
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<blockquote data-quote="Ruin Explorer" data-source="post: 9022029" data-attributes="member: 18"><p>I get what you're saying, but you're significantly wrong, just not quite in the way you might expect.</p><p></p><p>If this was the first MCU movie like this, and it had all this stuff in it, people would absolutely love it and be surprised and excited by it - there'd be weeping that they were losing this dude to DC. There'd be no similar-but-superior movies to compare it against - so all this stuff would be novel and shocking and cool. Stuff like the use of music, the deep cuts to '70s and '80s stuff? People would be blown away. The darker tone? People would be impressed. The way the characters interrelated? People would be like "Wow, they got Avengers-level chemistry in the first movie!" (which, note, GotG did have, so this isn't cheating). People would be like "This is so different from other MCU movies!" and "This is such a better movie-as-a-movie than almost any MCU movie!" and so on.</p><p></p><p>It absolutely is "that's how trilogies go" and your own thought experiment actually proves that! Literally the only reason you're not going "Wow this is remarkably good for an MCU movie!" is that it's got two superior relatives. Stuff that makes the original movie special is very difficult to replicate in sequels - what's really remarkable here is that GotG2 is (imho) a better movie than GotG.</p><p></p><p>THAT SAID, I do agree that the others are better - just that this is a relatively small drop-off. For me I'd say the first one was like an 8.5, the second a 9.0, and this like an 8.0 (grading on a really superhero-centric curve here, to be clear). Normally the drop-off is a lot steeper - see Die 1/2/3 for example. Die Hard is basically a straight classic highly rewatchable era-defining masculinity-defining-for-a-generation* movie so a 10.0 (or at worst like a 9.5 classic action thriller). Die Hard 2 is a lot more of a standard action movie that's trying to do the Die Hard tropes. On a very good day it's an 8.0 but I'd say more like a 7.0. And Die Hard 3 is a clunky reused Lethal Weapon script with literally two things people remember about it - more like a 6.0. And that's being generous.</p><p></p><p></p><p>Yes total agreement to all of this. And yeah I was thankful it wasn't bloody <em>Sabotage</em>. Re: The Replacements, I really think Gunn got out of his element because he foolishly gave himself that Zune, thus freeing himself of the constraints of his own good-quality musical taste, leading us to a sort of final celebration that to me looked and sounded like an Xmas advert for a very middle-class department store - John Lewis, specifically - I'm not quite sure what the US equivalent would be - Target is a lot like John Lewis but a bit downmarket from it. I'm still reeling from him using that, it's like so profoundly antithetical to the rest of what he's saying. It speaks to his age, I think. This is a song so profoundly safe and MoR I could see the current Labour party (an ultra-centrist party) using it in a party-political broadcast. If they haven't already.</p><p></p><p>* = there's been some good discussion of this - Kill James Bond talked about it a bit for example.</p></blockquote><p></p>
[QUOTE="Ruin Explorer, post: 9022029, member: 18"] I get what you're saying, but you're significantly wrong, just not quite in the way you might expect. If this was the first MCU movie like this, and it had all this stuff in it, people would absolutely love it and be surprised and excited by it - there'd be weeping that they were losing this dude to DC. There'd be no similar-but-superior movies to compare it against - so all this stuff would be novel and shocking and cool. Stuff like the use of music, the deep cuts to '70s and '80s stuff? People would be blown away. The darker tone? People would be impressed. The way the characters interrelated? People would be like "Wow, they got Avengers-level chemistry in the first movie!" (which, note, GotG did have, so this isn't cheating). People would be like "This is so different from other MCU movies!" and "This is such a better movie-as-a-movie than almost any MCU movie!" and so on. It absolutely is "that's how trilogies go" and your own thought experiment actually proves that! Literally the only reason you're not going "Wow this is remarkably good for an MCU movie!" is that it's got two superior relatives. Stuff that makes the original movie special is very difficult to replicate in sequels - what's really remarkable here is that GotG2 is (imho) a better movie than GotG. THAT SAID, I do agree that the others are better - just that this is a relatively small drop-off. For me I'd say the first one was like an 8.5, the second a 9.0, and this like an 8.0 (grading on a really superhero-centric curve here, to be clear). Normally the drop-off is a lot steeper - see Die 1/2/3 for example. Die Hard is basically a straight classic highly rewatchable era-defining masculinity-defining-for-a-generation* movie so a 10.0 (or at worst like a 9.5 classic action thriller). Die Hard 2 is a lot more of a standard action movie that's trying to do the Die Hard tropes. On a very good day it's an 8.0 but I'd say more like a 7.0. And Die Hard 3 is a clunky reused Lethal Weapon script with literally two things people remember about it - more like a 6.0. And that's being generous. Yes total agreement to all of this. And yeah I was thankful it wasn't bloody [I]Sabotage[/I]. Re: The Replacements, I really think Gunn got out of his element because he foolishly gave himself that Zune, thus freeing himself of the constraints of his own good-quality musical taste, leading us to a sort of final celebration that to me looked and sounded like an Xmas advert for a very middle-class department store - John Lewis, specifically - I'm not quite sure what the US equivalent would be - Target is a lot like John Lewis but a bit downmarket from it. I'm still reeling from him using that, it's like so profoundly antithetical to the rest of what he's saying. It speaks to his age, I think. This is a song so profoundly safe and MoR I could see the current Labour party (an ultra-centrist party) using it in a party-political broadcast. If they haven't already. * = there's been some good discussion of this - Kill James Bond talked about it a bit for example. [/QUOTE]
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