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[GUIDE] Stealth, Hiding and You!
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<blockquote data-quote="Noctem" data-source="post: 6702290" data-attributes="member: 6801315"><p>Part 4 Light and Darkness:</p><p></p><p>This section of the mini guide will cover game elements related to light and darkness with regards to hiding specifically. Let's start with this rule:</p><p></p><p>"A heavily obscured area-such as darkness, opaque fog, or dense foliage-blocks vision entirely. A creature in a heavily obscured area effectively suffers from the blinded condition."</p><p></p><p>EDIT: This rule has been errata'ed. You are no longer considered to be suffering from the blinded condition and instead are now simply "effectively blinded" while looking INTO heavy obscurement. This resolves the problem listed here since you can now see beyond the heavy obscurement such as in the image below. Bob the rogue who is standing in the heavy obscurement (the black areas) isn't automatically seen by an observer. But at the same time that observer is not prevented from seeing beyond the heavy obscurement in order to see the rest of the hallway. Kudos to Coolossus2123 for pointing out the errata.</p><p></p><p>For further clarifications for this section please see this discussion from the comments of this thread:</p><p></p><p><a href="http://www.enworld.org/forum/showthread.php?468715-GUIDE-Stealth-Hiding-and-You!/page3&p=7090347&viewfull=1#post7090347" target="_blank">http://www.enworld.org/forum/showthread.php?468715-GUIDE-Stealth-Hiding-and-You!/page3&p=7090347&viewfull=1#post7090347</a></p><p></p><p></p><p>Part 5: Surprise</p><p></p><p>Surprise has changed in 5e when compared to previous editions. It now functions as a condition that can affect characters or monsters at the start of an encounter during the first round until they have completed their first turn. There is no longer such a thing as a surprise round before the first round of the encounter for example like in 4e.</p><p></p><p>A surprised character or monster cannot take any actions until the end of their first turn at which point they may take a reaction if they have an ability to use one or are granted one via an Opportunity Attack for example. Some abilities, namely an Assassin archtype rogue, can gain benefits against surprised foes. Though not being able to act is quite a powerful penalty by default. Everything else happens as normal. Here is the breakdown for how and where surprise fits within the set up of an encounter:</p><p></p><p>1. Determine Surprise. The DM determines whether anyone involved in the combat encounter is surprise.</p><p>2. Establish positions. The DM decides where all the characters and monsters are located. Given the adventurers' marching order or their stated positions in the room or other location, the DM figures out where the adversaries are - how far away and in what direction.</p><p>3. Roll initiative. Everyone involved in the combat encounter rolls initiative, determining the order of combatants' turns.</p><p></p><p>It's important to note that a surprised character is no longer surprised after their first turn and that everyone rolls initiative as normal. So if Bob the Bandit is surprised but rolls well enough to go first in the initiative order, Charles the Assassin rogue won't get to benefit from his archtype features against surprised enemies since after Bob finishes his turn, he's no longer surprised.</p><p></p><p>The PHB (page 189) gives us two detailed scenarios and specific rules for how encounters which have hidden and non-hidden creatures works. Let's look at the first two:</p><p></p><p>"A band of adventurers sneaks up on a bandit camp, springing from the trees to attack them."</p><p>In this scenario, the band of adventurers is using stealth to become hidden and sneak up on their targets in order to surprise them.</p><p></p><p>"A gelatinous cube glides down a dungeon passage, unnoticed by the adventurers until the cube engulfs one of them."</p><p>In this scenario, the cube is not noticed by the adventurers until it attacks one of them, causing surprise. Note that stealth is not used, the cube simply needed to be "unnoticed" by the adventurers.</p><p></p><p>On the same page you can find the way that the DM is supposed to decide which character or monster might be surprised and why the second example is worded as it is:</p><p></p><p>"Any character or monster that doesn't notice a threat is surprised at the start of the encounter."</p><p></p><p>Essentially it all revolves around "noticing a threat". This is up to DM interpretation of course as he/she will decide what that means for the NPC's and depending on the situation, a PC. The rules do say however that usually noticing a threat uses the passive perception of a creature. Also note that the rules state that "a member of a group can be surprised even if the other members aren't". This covers situations where some creatures might notice a threat but others don't.</p><p></p><p>The rules found on page 189 also specifically explain how stealth, or the lack of it, is handled when it comes to surprise. This also brings us to the two other scenarios:</p><p></p><p>"If neither side tries to be stealthy, they automatically notice each other."</p><p>This explains that at the start of an encounter when determining surprise, if no one is trying to use stealth in order to hide, all participants of the encounter notice each other.</p><p></p><p>"Otherwise, the DM compares the Dexterity (Stealth) checks of anyone hiding with the passive Wisdom (Perception) score of each creature on the opposing side"</p><p>This is the other side of the coin. This just actually re-iterates the rules for stealth found earlier in both the PHB and this guide, but it's still important to show the two sides of this coin.</p><p></p><p>As you can see, Surprise actually revolves around "noticing threats". Achieving this can be done in many different ways and aren't limited to stealth and hiding. Here are a few examples:</p><p></p><p>"The rogue hiding in the dark room is not detected by the human guards passive perception. As he springs to attack, his opponent is surprised since he did not notice the threat."</p><p></p><p>"The rogue acts like an old man, using his skill at deception against the insight of the guard, to approach his target without appearing like a threat. The guard doesn't notice the danger until the rogue stabs him in the back."</p><p></p><p>"The king is having a feast at his castle and has invited the adventurers who have helped him rid his lands of the monsters which plagued it. While everyone is having a good time, the kings advisor suddenly stabs him to the surprise of everyone present."</p><p></p><p>"The thug moves amongst the busy crowd of the market, blending in with all the others who seek to purchase the many shiny things. The thug however has his eyes set on a bigger prize. He siddles up to his target and stabs him in the belly while the victim's eyes go wide with surprise."</p><p></p><p>These, along with the 4 scenarios in the rules themselves should help to understand the core principle of this game element. It doesn't matter how it happens, failing to notice a threat is paramount to being surprised in 5e.</p><p></p><p></p><p></p><p>Work in progress.</p></blockquote><p></p>
[QUOTE="Noctem, post: 6702290, member: 6801315"] Part 4 Light and Darkness: This section of the mini guide will cover game elements related to light and darkness with regards to hiding specifically. Let's start with this rule: "A heavily obscured area-such as darkness, opaque fog, or dense foliage-blocks vision entirely. A creature in a heavily obscured area effectively suffers from the blinded condition." EDIT: This rule has been errata'ed. You are no longer considered to be suffering from the blinded condition and instead are now simply "effectively blinded" while looking INTO heavy obscurement. This resolves the problem listed here since you can now see beyond the heavy obscurement such as in the image below. Bob the rogue who is standing in the heavy obscurement (the black areas) isn't automatically seen by an observer. But at the same time that observer is not prevented from seeing beyond the heavy obscurement in order to see the rest of the hallway. Kudos to Coolossus2123 for pointing out the errata. For further clarifications for this section please see this discussion from the comments of this thread: [url]http://www.enworld.org/forum/showthread.php?468715-GUIDE-Stealth-Hiding-and-You!/page3&p=7090347&viewfull=1#post7090347[/url] Part 5: Surprise Surprise has changed in 5e when compared to previous editions. It now functions as a condition that can affect characters or monsters at the start of an encounter during the first round until they have completed their first turn. There is no longer such a thing as a surprise round before the first round of the encounter for example like in 4e. A surprised character or monster cannot take any actions until the end of their first turn at which point they may take a reaction if they have an ability to use one or are granted one via an Opportunity Attack for example. Some abilities, namely an Assassin archtype rogue, can gain benefits against surprised foes. Though not being able to act is quite a powerful penalty by default. Everything else happens as normal. Here is the breakdown for how and where surprise fits within the set up of an encounter: 1. Determine Surprise. The DM determines whether anyone involved in the combat encounter is surprise. 2. Establish positions. The DM decides where all the characters and monsters are located. Given the adventurers' marching order or their stated positions in the room or other location, the DM figures out where the adversaries are - how far away and in what direction. 3. Roll initiative. Everyone involved in the combat encounter rolls initiative, determining the order of combatants' turns. It's important to note that a surprised character is no longer surprised after their first turn and that everyone rolls initiative as normal. So if Bob the Bandit is surprised but rolls well enough to go first in the initiative order, Charles the Assassin rogue won't get to benefit from his archtype features against surprised enemies since after Bob finishes his turn, he's no longer surprised. The PHB (page 189) gives us two detailed scenarios and specific rules for how encounters which have hidden and non-hidden creatures works. Let's look at the first two: "A band of adventurers sneaks up on a bandit camp, springing from the trees to attack them." In this scenario, the band of adventurers is using stealth to become hidden and sneak up on their targets in order to surprise them. "A gelatinous cube glides down a dungeon passage, unnoticed by the adventurers until the cube engulfs one of them." In this scenario, the cube is not noticed by the adventurers until it attacks one of them, causing surprise. Note that stealth is not used, the cube simply needed to be "unnoticed" by the adventurers. On the same page you can find the way that the DM is supposed to decide which character or monster might be surprised and why the second example is worded as it is: "Any character or monster that doesn't notice a threat is surprised at the start of the encounter." Essentially it all revolves around "noticing a threat". This is up to DM interpretation of course as he/she will decide what that means for the NPC's and depending on the situation, a PC. The rules do say however that usually noticing a threat uses the passive perception of a creature. Also note that the rules state that "a member of a group can be surprised even if the other members aren't". This covers situations where some creatures might notice a threat but others don't. The rules found on page 189 also specifically explain how stealth, or the lack of it, is handled when it comes to surprise. This also brings us to the two other scenarios: "If neither side tries to be stealthy, they automatically notice each other." This explains that at the start of an encounter when determining surprise, if no one is trying to use stealth in order to hide, all participants of the encounter notice each other. "Otherwise, the DM compares the Dexterity (Stealth) checks of anyone hiding with the passive Wisdom (Perception) score of each creature on the opposing side" This is the other side of the coin. This just actually re-iterates the rules for stealth found earlier in both the PHB and this guide, but it's still important to show the two sides of this coin. As you can see, Surprise actually revolves around "noticing threats". Achieving this can be done in many different ways and aren't limited to stealth and hiding. Here are a few examples: "The rogue hiding in the dark room is not detected by the human guards passive perception. As he springs to attack, his opponent is surprised since he did not notice the threat." "The rogue acts like an old man, using his skill at deception against the insight of the guard, to approach his target without appearing like a threat. The guard doesn't notice the danger until the rogue stabs him in the back." "The king is having a feast at his castle and has invited the adventurers who have helped him rid his lands of the monsters which plagued it. While everyone is having a good time, the kings advisor suddenly stabs him to the surprise of everyone present." "The thug moves amongst the busy crowd of the market, blending in with all the others who seek to purchase the many shiny things. The thug however has his eyes set on a bigger prize. He siddles up to his target and stabs him in the belly while the victim's eyes go wide with surprise." These, along with the 4 scenarios in the rules themselves should help to understand the core principle of this game element. It doesn't matter how it happens, failing to notice a threat is paramount to being surprised in 5e. Work in progress. [/QUOTE]
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