Menu
News
All News
Dungeons & Dragons
Level Up: Advanced 5th Edition
Pathfinder
Starfinder
Warhammer
2d20 System
Year Zero Engine
Industry News
Reviews
Dragon Reflections
Columns
Weekly Digests
Weekly News Digest
Freebies, Sales & Bundles
RPG Print News
RPG Crowdfunding News
Game Content
ENterplanetary DimENsions
Mythological Figures
Opinion
Worlds of Design
Peregrine's Next
RPG Evolution
Other Columns
From the Freelancing Frontline
Monster ENcyclopedia
WotC/TSR Alumni Look Back
4 Hours w/RSD (Ryan Dancey)
The Road to 3E (Jonathan Tweet)
Greenwood's Realms (Ed Greenwood)
Drawmij's TSR (Jim Ward)
Community
Forums & Topics
Forum List
Latest Posts
Forum list
*Dungeons & Dragons
Level Up: Advanced 5th Edition
D&D Older Editions
*TTRPGs General
*Pathfinder & Starfinder
EN Publishing
*Geek Talk & Media
Search forums
Chat/Discord
Resources
Wiki
Pages
Latest activity
Media
New media
New comments
Search media
Downloads
Latest reviews
Search resources
EN Publishing
Store
EN5ider
Adventures in ZEITGEIST
Awfully Cheerful Engine
What's OLD is NEW
Judge Dredd & The Worlds Of 2000AD
War of the Burning Sky
Level Up: Advanced 5E
Events & Releases
Upcoming Events
Private Events
Featured Events
Socials!
Twitch
YouTube
Facebook (EN Publishing)
Facebook (EN World)
Twitter
Instagram
TikTok
Podcast
Features
Top 5 RPGs Compiled Charts 2004-Present
Adventure Game Industry Market Research Summary (RPGs) V1.0
Ryan Dancey: Acquiring TSR
Q&A With Gary Gygax
D&D Rules FAQs
TSR, WotC, & Paizo: A Comparative History
D&D Pronunciation Guide
Million Dollar TTRPG Kickstarters
Tabletop RPG Podcast Hall of Fame
Eric Noah's Unofficial D&D 3rd Edition News
D&D in the Mainstream
D&D & RPG History
About Morrus
Log in
Register
What's new
Search
Search
Search titles only
By:
Forums & Topics
Forum List
Latest Posts
Forum list
*Dungeons & Dragons
Level Up: Advanced 5th Edition
D&D Older Editions
*TTRPGs General
*Pathfinder & Starfinder
EN Publishing
*Geek Talk & Media
Search forums
Chat/Discord
Menu
Log in
Register
Install the app
Install
The
VOIDRUNNER'S CODEX
is coming! Explore new worlds, fight oppressive empires, fend off fearsome aliens, and wield deadly psionics with this comprehensive boxed set expansion for 5E and A5E!
Community
General Tabletop Discussion
*TTRPGs General
"HF" vs. "S&S" gaming: the underlying reason of conflict and change in D&D
JavaScript is disabled. For a better experience, please enable JavaScript in your browser before proceeding.
You are using an out of date browser. It may not display this or other websites correctly.
You should upgrade or use an
alternative browser
.
Reply to thread
Message
<blockquote data-quote="catsclaw227" data-source="post: 4818993" data-attributes="member: 14197"><p>I haven't read through the essays you linked to, so take my comments with that in mind.</p><p></p><p>It sounds here to me like you are redefining what Sword & Sorcery and High Fatasy are to help support your claims. Personally, High Fantasy has little to do with Christianity, any more than Sword and Sorcery has to do with Atheism.</p><p></p><p>Conan, Elric, Fafhrd & Grey Mouser... each are icons of Sword & Sorcery literature (though Elric COULD be considered High Fantasy, as there seems to be more fantastical than grim & gritty.) But their stories had just as many elements that made sense in 4e as elements that would only be found in OD&D games. And each were rife with Gods. Good ones, Evil Ones and even indifferent ones. Ones that stayed out of the affairs of mortals and ones that were actively involved.</p><p></p><p>In my opinion, your non-exhaustive list are things that differentiate the gaming movements aren't any more important than the following are differentiations:</p><p></p><ul> <li data-xf-list-type="ul">Unified Mechanics vs. unrelated and inconsistent subsystems</li> <li data-xf-list-type="ul">PCs follow/don't follow same rules as NPCs or other "DM" elements</li> <li data-xf-list-type="ul">Structured real-world style Ecologies vs. Orcs bunking next to Shriekers next to lurkers and mimics in interconnecting stone 20x20 rooms.</li> <li data-xf-list-type="ul">"I can only have an 16 in that stat?" vs "Awesome, a 14!"</li> <li data-xf-list-type="ul">APs vs Sandbox vs Delves with Minis</li> <li data-xf-list-type="ul">Narrativist vs Simulationist vs Gamist</li> </ul><p></p><p>And yet, NONE of these have anything to do wth High Fantasy or Sword & Sorcery by any definition of the terms that are commonly known by gamers.</p><p></p><p>We played high fantasy with AD&D back in 1978 and it worked just fine. And I have run a Swords & Sorcery style game with d20 and OGL games.</p><p></p><p>I guess, I just don't agree that we need to redefine these terms in an effort to (once again) create another divide between what is fun for two different groups.</p><p></p><p>Some like "old-school" style rulesets (and I really dislike that term) and some like the OGL edition or the current edition.</p><p></p><p>I guess what I am asking is...... What is the point of the exercise?</p><p></p><p>Between a recent Grognardia article and this one, I am starting to feel like there are people that are bent on driving a wedge deeper between disagreeing factions of our hobby. </p><p></p><p>I ask.... "To what end?"</p></blockquote><p></p>
[QUOTE="catsclaw227, post: 4818993, member: 14197"] I haven't read through the essays you linked to, so take my comments with that in mind. It sounds here to me like you are redefining what Sword & Sorcery and High Fatasy are to help support your claims. Personally, High Fantasy has little to do with Christianity, any more than Sword and Sorcery has to do with Atheism. Conan, Elric, Fafhrd & Grey Mouser... each are icons of Sword & Sorcery literature (though Elric COULD be considered High Fantasy, as there seems to be more fantastical than grim & gritty.) But their stories had just as many elements that made sense in 4e as elements that would only be found in OD&D games. And each were rife with Gods. Good ones, Evil Ones and even indifferent ones. Ones that stayed out of the affairs of mortals and ones that were actively involved. In my opinion, your non-exhaustive list are things that differentiate the gaming movements aren't any more important than the following are differentiations: [list] [*]Unified Mechanics vs. unrelated and inconsistent subsystems [*]PCs follow/don't follow same rules as NPCs or other "DM" elements [*]Structured real-world style Ecologies vs. Orcs bunking next to Shriekers next to lurkers and mimics in interconnecting stone 20x20 rooms. [*]"I can only have an 16 in that stat?" vs "Awesome, a 14!" [*]APs vs Sandbox vs Delves with Minis [*]Narrativist vs Simulationist vs Gamist [/list] And yet, NONE of these have anything to do wth High Fantasy or Sword & Sorcery by any definition of the terms that are commonly known by gamers. We played high fantasy with AD&D back in 1978 and it worked just fine. And I have run a Swords & Sorcery style game with d20 and OGL games. I guess, I just don't agree that we need to redefine these terms in an effort to (once again) create another divide between what is fun for two different groups. Some like "old-school" style rulesets (and I really dislike that term) and some like the OGL edition or the current edition. I guess what I am asking is...... What is the point of the exercise? Between a recent Grognardia article and this one, I am starting to feel like there are people that are bent on driving a wedge deeper between disagreeing factions of our hobby. I ask.... "To what end?" [/QUOTE]
Insert quotes…
Verification
Post reply
Community
General Tabletop Discussion
*TTRPGs General
"HF" vs. "S&S" gaming: the underlying reason of conflict and change in D&D
Top