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High-Level Play: Nightmare for DMs?
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<blockquote data-quote="rushlight" data-source="post: 1684790" data-attributes="member: 3801"><p>The 20th level fighter in my campaign can dish out 200+ points of damage per round, given the right circumstances. The mage can come close, but only a few times before those spells are gone - but he can do it usually regardless of the abilities of the enemy. That's fairly balanced. </p><p></p><p>I don't see how those spells are more powerful than other 20th level abilities. Druids get awesome wildshape. Fighters have a feat list a mile long to make them all nasty. Clerics have spells too. Monks can be whirling death dealers. Rogues are dealing out piles of sneak attack damage. Rangers can pelt an enemy with a rain of deadly arrows. Etcetera, etcetera. Not to mention that most of those classes can use their abilities an endless number of times. If your DM lets you just fight one battle and then rest, then the problem is with your DM - not the spells. Your wizard should be cautious when casting all his uber spells in one battle. That's usually a mistake the wizard only makes once.</p><p></p><p></p><p></p><p>That's not true. If you've been Disjoined, you can still cast your own Disjoin. Not to mention that items get their owner's will saves - and 20th level mages generally have high will saves. Besides, as a DM I'd think very, very hard before I cast Disjoin against the party. You'd need to be sure that they could stay within the appropriate wealth bracket for their level, despite any losses.</p><p></p><p></p><p></p><p>Okay. </p><p></p><p>Round 1</p><p></p><p>Wizard goes first: wizard Shapechanges into a Pit Fiend. </p><p>Dragon goes next: dragon casts Greater Dispel Magic. Wizard becomes himself again.</p><p></p><p>Why is this unbalanced? If your DM isn't effectively using the same abilites the PCs can, then again the problem is with your DM, not the rules. There's also Anti-magic field, or baleful polymorph, or many other ways to deal with a shapechanged wizard. </p><p></p><p>For every PC ability - even 9th level ones - there are effective methods of keeping the challenge in the game. It's just harder at high levels. To run a high level game, the DM must know the abilities of every class inside and out, and be very familar with every spell, and every monster's ability. The DM of a high level game must really understand the nooks and crannies of the game. He can't slide by like he could at 5th or even 15th level. Running a high level game isn't for the neophyte DM. The players only need to know only one small aspect (their chosen class) to be very effective. The DM needs to know everything the players know, and then some.</p></blockquote><p></p>
[QUOTE="rushlight, post: 1684790, member: 3801"] The 20th level fighter in my campaign can dish out 200+ points of damage per round, given the right circumstances. The mage can come close, but only a few times before those spells are gone - but he can do it usually regardless of the abilities of the enemy. That's fairly balanced. I don't see how those spells are more powerful than other 20th level abilities. Druids get awesome wildshape. Fighters have a feat list a mile long to make them all nasty. Clerics have spells too. Monks can be whirling death dealers. Rogues are dealing out piles of sneak attack damage. Rangers can pelt an enemy with a rain of deadly arrows. Etcetera, etcetera. Not to mention that most of those classes can use their abilities an endless number of times. If your DM lets you just fight one battle and then rest, then the problem is with your DM - not the spells. Your wizard should be cautious when casting all his uber spells in one battle. That's usually a mistake the wizard only makes once. That's not true. If you've been Disjoined, you can still cast your own Disjoin. Not to mention that items get their owner's will saves - and 20th level mages generally have high will saves. Besides, as a DM I'd think very, very hard before I cast Disjoin against the party. You'd need to be sure that they could stay within the appropriate wealth bracket for their level, despite any losses. Okay. Round 1 Wizard goes first: wizard Shapechanges into a Pit Fiend. Dragon goes next: dragon casts Greater Dispel Magic. Wizard becomes himself again. Why is this unbalanced? If your DM isn't effectively using the same abilites the PCs can, then again the problem is with your DM, not the rules. There's also Anti-magic field, or baleful polymorph, or many other ways to deal with a shapechanged wizard. For every PC ability - even 9th level ones - there are effective methods of keeping the challenge in the game. It's just harder at high levels. To run a high level game, the DM must know the abilities of every class inside and out, and be very familar with every spell, and every monster's ability. The DM of a high level game must really understand the nooks and crannies of the game. He can't slide by like he could at 5th or even 15th level. Running a high level game isn't for the neophyte DM. The players only need to know only one small aspect (their chosen class) to be very effective. The DM needs to know everything the players know, and then some. [/QUOTE]
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High-Level Play: Nightmare for DMs?
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