Menu
News
All News
Dungeons & Dragons
Level Up: Advanced 5th Edition
Pathfinder
Starfinder
Warhammer
2d20 System
Year Zero Engine
Industry News
Reviews
Dragon Reflections
Columns
Weekly Digests
Weekly News Digest
Freebies, Sales & Bundles
RPG Print News
RPG Crowdfunding News
Game Content
ENterplanetary DimENsions
Mythological Figures
Opinion
Worlds of Design
Peregrine's Next
RPG Evolution
Other Columns
From the Freelancing Frontline
Monster ENcyclopedia
WotC/TSR Alumni Look Back
4 Hours w/RSD (Ryan Dancey)
The Road to 3E (Jonathan Tweet)
Greenwood's Realms (Ed Greenwood)
Drawmij's TSR (Jim Ward)
Community
Forums & Topics
Forum List
Latest Posts
Forum list
*Dungeons & Dragons
Level Up: Advanced 5th Edition
D&D Older Editions
*TTRPGs General
*Pathfinder & Starfinder
EN Publishing
*Geek Talk & Media
Search forums
Chat/Discord
Resources
Wiki
Pages
Latest activity
Media
New media
New comments
Search media
Downloads
Latest reviews
Search resources
EN Publishing
Store
EN5ider
Adventures in ZEITGEIST
Awfully Cheerful Engine
What's OLD is NEW
Judge Dredd & The Worlds Of 2000AD
War of the Burning Sky
Level Up: Advanced 5E
Events & Releases
Upcoming Events
Private Events
Featured Events
Socials!
Twitch
YouTube
Facebook (EN Publishing)
Facebook (EN World)
Twitter
Instagram
TikTok
Podcast
Features
Top 5 RPGs Compiled Charts 2004-Present
Adventure Game Industry Market Research Summary (RPGs) V1.0
Ryan Dancey: Acquiring TSR
Q&A With Gary Gygax
D&D Rules FAQs
TSR, WotC, & Paizo: A Comparative History
D&D Pronunciation Guide
Million Dollar TTRPG Kickstarters
Tabletop RPG Podcast Hall of Fame
Eric Noah's Unofficial D&D 3rd Edition News
D&D in the Mainstream
D&D & RPG History
About Morrus
Log in
Register
What's new
Search
Search
Search titles only
By:
Forums & Topics
Forum List
Latest Posts
Forum list
*Dungeons & Dragons
Level Up: Advanced 5th Edition
D&D Older Editions
*TTRPGs General
*Pathfinder & Starfinder
EN Publishing
*Geek Talk & Media
Search forums
Chat/Discord
Menu
Log in
Register
Install the app
Install
Community
General Tabletop Discussion
D&D Older Editions
Hitting "reset": A counterpoint to "gritty" 4e
JavaScript is disabled. For a better experience, please enable JavaScript in your browser before proceeding.
You are using an out of date browser. It may not display this or other websites correctly.
You should upgrade or use an
alternative browser
.
Reply to thread
Message
<blockquote data-quote="Dragonblade" data-source="post: 3978396" data-attributes="member: 2804"><p>So there has been a lot of discussion back and forth on whether 4e is making the game too "easy". That its not "gritty" enough. Some old school gamers miss save or die, or level draining. They like the Warhammer style of play where even a bar fight could end their life.</p><p></p><p>However, for my group we are really looking forward to 4e precisely because it lessens grit. We like cinematic heroics. Heroes who can take on dragons and walk away without permnanent disabilities.</p><p></p><p>Many of us have been gaming for 10+ years. Some of us (including myself) over 20 years. After our last Age of Worms session (likely our last 3.5 game), we had an interesting discussion after almost getting TPKed (which would have been our 2nd TPK in AoW had it happened). We talked about character death and after all the work we have put into our characters, seeing our characters die is almost like seeing all that work wasted. But all of us agreed that the threat of death is important to creating tension and excitement. No one wants to die, but its no fun to play a game where your character is untouchable. What would the point of playing be after all?</p><p></p><p>One of our players even went so far as to say that if his character dies, he'll be done playing. At least until 4e comes out and even then he isn't sure he would play again. He has lost so many characters and/or had so many campaigns start strong and then fizzle over the span of his many years of gaming that the will to make yet another new PC has been all but beaten out of him. But yet, being resurrected doesn't appeal to him either. Ironically, he felt it would cheapen the death of his character should it actually occur.</p><p></p><p>Gritty is what our group absolutely does not want. We want the threat of death, and we want death to be real, but we don't want to actually die. How can we reconcile these two seemingly opposite concepts?</p><p></p><p>After much discussion on ways avoid PC death, but yet not make it seem like we have plot immunity, we hit upon a solution. The next time a PC dies, our DM will let us hit "reset" like we were playing a video game. We will be able to rewind back to before that battle and replay it again (or perhaps even run away this time). This might be much too metagamey for some groups taste, but it seems like it would work out well for our group. I wanted to post this here, because I think it illustrates the drawback of gritty games. Sure they seem "real" but for my group, its certainly not a fun playstyle.</p><p></p><p>Have any other groups done anything similar? I wonder if the 4e DMG will offer a similar idea.</p></blockquote><p></p>
[QUOTE="Dragonblade, post: 3978396, member: 2804"] So there has been a lot of discussion back and forth on whether 4e is making the game too "easy". That its not "gritty" enough. Some old school gamers miss save or die, or level draining. They like the Warhammer style of play where even a bar fight could end their life. However, for my group we are really looking forward to 4e precisely because it lessens grit. We like cinematic heroics. Heroes who can take on dragons and walk away without permnanent disabilities. Many of us have been gaming for 10+ years. Some of us (including myself) over 20 years. After our last Age of Worms session (likely our last 3.5 game), we had an interesting discussion after almost getting TPKed (which would have been our 2nd TPK in AoW had it happened). We talked about character death and after all the work we have put into our characters, seeing our characters die is almost like seeing all that work wasted. But all of us agreed that the threat of death is important to creating tension and excitement. No one wants to die, but its no fun to play a game where your character is untouchable. What would the point of playing be after all? One of our players even went so far as to say that if his character dies, he'll be done playing. At least until 4e comes out and even then he isn't sure he would play again. He has lost so many characters and/or had so many campaigns start strong and then fizzle over the span of his many years of gaming that the will to make yet another new PC has been all but beaten out of him. But yet, being resurrected doesn't appeal to him either. Ironically, he felt it would cheapen the death of his character should it actually occur. Gritty is what our group absolutely does not want. We want the threat of death, and we want death to be real, but we don't want to actually die. How can we reconcile these two seemingly opposite concepts? After much discussion on ways avoid PC death, but yet not make it seem like we have plot immunity, we hit upon a solution. The next time a PC dies, our DM will let us hit "reset" like we were playing a video game. We will be able to rewind back to before that battle and replay it again (or perhaps even run away this time). This might be much too metagamey for some groups taste, but it seems like it would work out well for our group. I wanted to post this here, because I think it illustrates the drawback of gritty games. Sure they seem "real" but for my group, its certainly not a fun playstyle. Have any other groups done anything similar? I wonder if the 4e DMG will offer a similar idea. [/QUOTE]
Insert quotes…
Verification
Post reply
Community
General Tabletop Discussion
D&D Older Editions
Hitting "reset": A counterpoint to "gritty" 4e
Top