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How Gary Gygax lost control of D&D
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<blockquote data-quote="evileeyore" data-source="post: 6348787" data-attributes="member: 1768"><p>So you play D&D and complain it feels like D&D...</p><p></p><p></p><p>Sigh.</p><p></p><p></p><p>As it is with every other edition of D&D.</p><p></p><p></p><p></p><p></p><p></p><p>And your wrong.</p><p></p><p>Hold your questions until the History Lesson Ride is over...</p><p></p><p></p><p></p><p>MAR Barker was working on stuff for Tekumiel (to help him figure out the world of Tekumiel), but as D&D came along at the right moment for him he grabbed it and used it instead (he's a linguist scholar like Tolkien, not a miniature wargame rules creator like Gygax).</p><p></p><p>Greg Stafford was trying to figure out other stuff for his book series (things different from the run of tactical wargames, his first attempt was a board game) and eventually (4 years after D&D) made Runequest.</p><p></p><p>Mark Miller incorporated GDW (with Frank Chadwick) in 73 and was developing board games and RPGs at the same time Gygax and Arneson were developing D&D. Frank Chadwick was reinventing and innovating wargames at the time and developed <em>En Garde!</em> (published 1 year after D&D) which is a game where you play a gentlemen duelist in 17th century Paris.</p><p></p><p>Slobbovia (which started being played in 1969) was a play-by-mail roleplaying game, while the roles you played were things like Ruler of Country or General of Army, the game was about advancing your character more so than the game it was based on... Diplomacy.</p><p></p><p></p><p>So yes, plenty of people were developing towards rpgs, it's just Dave (Arneson) took two things, Gary's (Gygax) Chainmail mass combat rules (which allowed for individual heroes) and (David) Wesley's Braunstein and made something different: Blackmoor. Gary then developed better rules for Dave's game, and from here the current history of RPGs were written.</p><p></p><p></p><p></p><p>Keep in mind though, without encountering David Wesley's Braunstein, Arneson would have likely not stopped fiddling with naval miniatures and Napoleonic recreations (it's what he was still fiddling with when I gamed with him 10 years ago). Solo heroic roleplaying wasn't something he really was into, until Braunstein. And without Blackmoor, Gygax would have continued developing mass combat rules in Chainmail.</p><p></p><p></p><p></p><p>/History Lesson Ride</p><p></p><p></p><p></p><p>A - It probably would have taken 2-4 more years...</p><p>B - It probably would be a bit more niche. Though we'd likely still have it becoming the break-away hit rpgs are now with video games, so the table-top games would be going through (or just be peaking in) a revolution of interest among the "non-geek" masses (as we're just coming down from).</p></blockquote><p></p>
[QUOTE="evileeyore, post: 6348787, member: 1768"] So you play D&D and complain it feels like D&D... Sigh. As it is with every other edition of D&D. And your wrong. Hold your questions until the History Lesson Ride is over... MAR Barker was working on stuff for Tekumiel (to help him figure out the world of Tekumiel), but as D&D came along at the right moment for him he grabbed it and used it instead (he's a linguist scholar like Tolkien, not a miniature wargame rules creator like Gygax). Greg Stafford was trying to figure out other stuff for his book series (things different from the run of tactical wargames, his first attempt was a board game) and eventually (4 years after D&D) made Runequest. Mark Miller incorporated GDW (with Frank Chadwick) in 73 and was developing board games and RPGs at the same time Gygax and Arneson were developing D&D. Frank Chadwick was reinventing and innovating wargames at the time and developed [i]En Garde![/i] (published 1 year after D&D) which is a game where you play a gentlemen duelist in 17th century Paris. Slobbovia (which started being played in 1969) was a play-by-mail roleplaying game, while the roles you played were things like Ruler of Country or General of Army, the game was about advancing your character more so than the game it was based on... Diplomacy. So yes, plenty of people were developing towards rpgs, it's just Dave (Arneson) took two things, Gary's (Gygax) Chainmail mass combat rules (which allowed for individual heroes) and (David) Wesley's Braunstein and made something different: Blackmoor. Gary then developed better rules for Dave's game, and from here the current history of RPGs were written. Keep in mind though, without encountering David Wesley's Braunstein, Arneson would have likely not stopped fiddling with naval miniatures and Napoleonic recreations (it's what he was still fiddling with when I gamed with him 10 years ago). Solo heroic roleplaying wasn't something he really was into, until Braunstein. And without Blackmoor, Gygax would have continued developing mass combat rules in Chainmail. /History Lesson Ride A - It probably would have taken 2-4 more years... B - It probably would be a bit more niche. Though we'd likely still have it becoming the break-away hit rpgs are now with video games, so the table-top games would be going through (or just be peaking in) a revolution of interest among the "non-geek" masses (as we're just coming down from). [/QUOTE]
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