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How Long Before the Digital Dam Breaks?
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<blockquote data-quote="Cergorach" data-source="post: 7745429" data-attributes="member: 725"><p>What people also seem to forget is that us consumers don't have infinite space, I currently have a 30 year collection of books, board/card games and miniatures in a room that has more storage space then a lot of people's entire apartments... Especially books and comics, unless it's something truly special, I often just get the pdf. And even then, I'm more picky on what to get because there's so much available these days that I don't have time for everything.</p><p></p><p>As for 3D printers... That's so much misinformation!</p><p></p><p>Making a 3D print is not like making a printout of a page or even a book. Most affordable printers also require skill to use that people who haven't used one before don't really understand. This is not a Star Trek matter assembler!</p><p></p><p>A 3D print requires:</p><p>- A 3D printer</p><p>- A 3D file</p><p>- Material</p><p>- Power</p><p>- TIME</p><p></p><p>A 3D printer rangers from the $100 to the $1,000,000+, then there are different types of printing that have pros/cons and purposes.</p><p></p><p>The 'cheapest' are FDM printers, those have a printhead and deposit material like some sort of inkjet printer. There's a limit on how fine the details are and you're often stuck with visible layer lines. These might be appropriate for some types of terrain, but not human sized 25-35mm models. Still, you get what you pay for, a $100 model often won't perform as well as a highend $3500 model. Personally I'm buying am Original Prusa I3 MK3, that's a $749 kit (plus shipping), a kit that requires assembly. Assembled that printer costs $999. This is one of the most silent and advanced models of it's class (hobbyist), you can buy professional models at $30.000 that are far more user friendly, but wholly outside of the hobbyist purview. </p><p></p><p>If you want to print 25-35mm human sized models, you'll be looking at SLA printers (like the Form 2, a $3500 printer) that use lasers. Or DLP printer (like the AnyCubic Photon, a $499 printer that uses a projector. SLA printers give sharper details, DLP a little softer details. Both use UV cured resins (which are very tocix btw.) and can be quite messy in operation. Also, the resin isn't cheap. What people forget is that a 32mm model might easily take 5 hours to print on the AnyCubic Photon and no guarantee that the print wil lbe perfect after that. During those 5 hours you need to ventilate the room quite well due to the uv resin fumes. After that it's cleaning the print with alcohol and curing it with UV light. And even then it's still not as strong and durable as PVC or HIPS plastic.</p><p></p><p>Also, most of the models need 'supports' that make sure the different parts don't falloff or get warped during printing, those require cleanup. In some cases more then traditional assembly of models and moldline cleanup.</p><p></p><p>Then we have the quality of models, 99,99% on thingyverse is junk compared to the details of a high quality resin model. I've seen some high quality 3D model files available, those are either samples, illegally distributed files or paid for model files. Those often start at the $5+ range if it's of common use, but expect $30+ for 'unique' character models. Making them yourself doesn't ignore the legality issue and doesn't guarantee that it's of quality and takes a lot of time.</p><p></p><p>MAYBE it could be cheaper if you compare it to a $50+ (FW) resin model, but certainly not to a $30, which you can get online (legally) for $22.50. Not in costs and material. And certainly not when you compare it to a 72 model box of Zombicide for $99 (or $80 online)! But if you want similar quality to a FW model you'll need a $3500+ printer...</p><p></p><p>Companies like GW do need to keep in mind that there's a limit on the price they can ask for a single miniature due to 3D printing, but certainly their plastic range isn't yet in danger of that. No, a 3D printer is great for models that don't exist yet in an available </p><p></p><p>Hell, if you want cheaper miniatures and don't have any issues with legality (due to the 3d model files and protected IP), why buy an expensive printer at all? You can buy recasts (illegal!) from multiple sources, or is you don't value your time, you can always make copies yourself (illegal!)...</p><p></p><p>And while you can 3D files cheap, you get what you pay for. $2.50/model, I don't get really excited for:</p><p><a href="http://www.illgottengames.net/products/?category=Miniatures" target="_blank">http://www.illgottengames.net/products/?category=Miniatures</a></p><p></p><p>You want better quality, you pay for it! $19.99 for a large beholder like model:</p><p><a href="http://www.rocketpiggames.com/store#!/Monster-Miniatures/c/23474014/offset=0&sort=normal" target="_blank">http://www.rocketpiggames.com/store#!/Monster-Miniatures/c/23474014/offset=0&sort=normal</a></p><p></p><p>There are of course far better deals:</p><p><a href="https://www.cgtrader.com/crosslances" target="_blank">https://www.cgtrader.com/crosslances</a></p><p></p><p>But it's what your looking for and what the other part is asking for their work, just like in RL...</p></blockquote><p></p>
[QUOTE="Cergorach, post: 7745429, member: 725"] What people also seem to forget is that us consumers don't have infinite space, I currently have a 30 year collection of books, board/card games and miniatures in a room that has more storage space then a lot of people's entire apartments... Especially books and comics, unless it's something truly special, I often just get the pdf. And even then, I'm more picky on what to get because there's so much available these days that I don't have time for everything. As for 3D printers... That's so much misinformation! Making a 3D print is not like making a printout of a page or even a book. Most affordable printers also require skill to use that people who haven't used one before don't really understand. This is not a Star Trek matter assembler! A 3D print requires: - A 3D printer - A 3D file - Material - Power - TIME A 3D printer rangers from the $100 to the $1,000,000+, then there are different types of printing that have pros/cons and purposes. The 'cheapest' are FDM printers, those have a printhead and deposit material like some sort of inkjet printer. There's a limit on how fine the details are and you're often stuck with visible layer lines. These might be appropriate for some types of terrain, but not human sized 25-35mm models. Still, you get what you pay for, a $100 model often won't perform as well as a highend $3500 model. Personally I'm buying am Original Prusa I3 MK3, that's a $749 kit (plus shipping), a kit that requires assembly. Assembled that printer costs $999. This is one of the most silent and advanced models of it's class (hobbyist), you can buy professional models at $30.000 that are far more user friendly, but wholly outside of the hobbyist purview. If you want to print 25-35mm human sized models, you'll be looking at SLA printers (like the Form 2, a $3500 printer) that use lasers. Or DLP printer (like the AnyCubic Photon, a $499 printer that uses a projector. SLA printers give sharper details, DLP a little softer details. Both use UV cured resins (which are very tocix btw.) and can be quite messy in operation. Also, the resin isn't cheap. What people forget is that a 32mm model might easily take 5 hours to print on the AnyCubic Photon and no guarantee that the print wil lbe perfect after that. During those 5 hours you need to ventilate the room quite well due to the uv resin fumes. After that it's cleaning the print with alcohol and curing it with UV light. And even then it's still not as strong and durable as PVC or HIPS plastic. Also, most of the models need 'supports' that make sure the different parts don't falloff or get warped during printing, those require cleanup. In some cases more then traditional assembly of models and moldline cleanup. Then we have the quality of models, 99,99% on thingyverse is junk compared to the details of a high quality resin model. I've seen some high quality 3D model files available, those are either samples, illegally distributed files or paid for model files. Those often start at the $5+ range if it's of common use, but expect $30+ for 'unique' character models. Making them yourself doesn't ignore the legality issue and doesn't guarantee that it's of quality and takes a lot of time. MAYBE it could be cheaper if you compare it to a $50+ (FW) resin model, but certainly not to a $30, which you can get online (legally) for $22.50. Not in costs and material. And certainly not when you compare it to a 72 model box of Zombicide for $99 (or $80 online)! But if you want similar quality to a FW model you'll need a $3500+ printer... Companies like GW do need to keep in mind that there's a limit on the price they can ask for a single miniature due to 3D printing, but certainly their plastic range isn't yet in danger of that. No, a 3D printer is great for models that don't exist yet in an available Hell, if you want cheaper miniatures and don't have any issues with legality (due to the 3d model files and protected IP), why buy an expensive printer at all? You can buy recasts (illegal!) from multiple sources, or is you don't value your time, you can always make copies yourself (illegal!)... And while you can 3D files cheap, you get what you pay for. $2.50/model, I don't get really excited for: [url]http://www.illgottengames.net/products/?category=Miniatures[/url] You want better quality, you pay for it! $19.99 for a large beholder like model: [url]http://www.rocketpiggames.com/store#!/Monster-Miniatures/c/23474014/offset=0&sort=normal[/url] There are of course far better deals: [url]https://www.cgtrader.com/crosslances[/url] But it's what your looking for and what the other part is asking for their work, just like in RL... [/QUOTE]
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