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How much should 5e aim at balance?
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<blockquote data-quote="Ahnehnois" data-source="post: 5985040" data-attributes="member: 17106"><p>Has this been defined? No. But repeated statements to the effect that virtually all editions of D&D are egregiously outside these boundaries suggest an extremely narrow definition.</p><p></p><p>No, it's not just an arbitrary preference. </p><p></p><p>IMO, a pretty charitable reading. Referring to [MENTION=3400]billd91[/MENTION] above or posts like this:</p><p></p><p></p><p></p><p>More to the point, who would deny that there is a market for non-4e D&D?</p><p></p><p>The issue isn't whether their preferences should be acknowledged, but whether they should be imposed on everyone else. If 4e's unified character creation mechanics and what you term as "metagame mechanics" are a model, that model clearly does this.</p><p></p><p>The system doesn't allow for characters or other game elements from other editions of D&D to be rendered effectively; i.e. there is no 4e character that could provide an approximately similar mechanical representation and play experience to my 3e (or earlier) fighter, wizard, rogue, druid, etc. In general, this is not true of the rest of D&D; while significant changes need be made, a character can be converted between editions (possibly incrementally changing how it is balanced, but retaining its basic features). A beginner finds in 4e a system that forces them into a much narrower design space than previous editions, preventing them from creating any character that is outside the AEDU, limited multiclassing, standard modifier box. Even if the result is increased "balance" (which I remain unconvinced of), it's exclusionary. I think it's fair to say that it's exclusionary to the majority of the D&D population, given the current state of the business. If I can't create a functioning version of every D&D character, monster, spell, etc. from earlier editions (because it isn't "balanced"), the goal of the unity edition has not been met.</p><p></p><p>Thusfar, 5e has not taken that approach; it seems to be erring on the side of letting people play what they want and not imposing such profound restrictions on them (despite its many other problems thusfar). Can I conclude that you are in the camp that doesn't think 5e will or should appeal to the 4e diehards because of this?</p></blockquote><p></p>
[QUOTE="Ahnehnois, post: 5985040, member: 17106"] Has this been defined? No. But repeated statements to the effect that virtually all editions of D&D are egregiously outside these boundaries suggest an extremely narrow definition. No, it's not just an arbitrary preference. IMO, a pretty charitable reading. Referring to [MENTION=3400]billd91[/MENTION] above or posts like this: More to the point, who would deny that there is a market for non-4e D&D? The issue isn't whether their preferences should be acknowledged, but whether they should be imposed on everyone else. If 4e's unified character creation mechanics and what you term as "metagame mechanics" are a model, that model clearly does this. The system doesn't allow for characters or other game elements from other editions of D&D to be rendered effectively; i.e. there is no 4e character that could provide an approximately similar mechanical representation and play experience to my 3e (or earlier) fighter, wizard, rogue, druid, etc. In general, this is not true of the rest of D&D; while significant changes need be made, a character can be converted between editions (possibly incrementally changing how it is balanced, but retaining its basic features). A beginner finds in 4e a system that forces them into a much narrower design space than previous editions, preventing them from creating any character that is outside the AEDU, limited multiclassing, standard modifier box. Even if the result is increased "balance" (which I remain unconvinced of), it's exclusionary. I think it's fair to say that it's exclusionary to the majority of the D&D population, given the current state of the business. If I can't create a functioning version of every D&D character, monster, spell, etc. from earlier editions (because it isn't "balanced"), the goal of the unity edition has not been met. Thusfar, 5e has not taken that approach; it seems to be erring on the side of letting people play what they want and not imposing such profound restrictions on them (despite its many other problems thusfar). Can I conclude that you are in the camp that doesn't think 5e will or should appeal to the 4e diehards because of this? [/QUOTE]
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