Menu
News
All News
Dungeons & Dragons
Level Up: Advanced 5th Edition
Pathfinder
Starfinder
Warhammer
2d20 System
Year Zero Engine
Industry News
Reviews
Dragon Reflections
Columns
Weekly Digests
Weekly News Digest
Freebies, Sales & Bundles
RPG Print News
RPG Crowdfunding News
Game Content
ENterplanetary DimENsions
Mythological Figures
Opinion
Worlds of Design
Peregrine's Next
RPG Evolution
Other Columns
From the Freelancing Frontline
Monster ENcyclopedia
WotC/TSR Alumni Look Back
4 Hours w/RSD (Ryan Dancey)
The Road to 3E (Jonathan Tweet)
Greenwood's Realms (Ed Greenwood)
Drawmij's TSR (Jim Ward)
Community
Forums & Topics
Forum List
Latest Posts
Forum list
*Dungeons & Dragons
Level Up: Advanced 5th Edition
D&D Older Editions
*TTRPGs General
*Pathfinder & Starfinder
EN Publishing
*Geek Talk & Media
Search forums
Chat/Discord
Resources
Wiki
Pages
Latest activity
Media
New media
New comments
Search media
Downloads
Latest reviews
Search resources
EN Publishing
Store
EN5ider
Adventures in ZEITGEIST
Awfully Cheerful Engine
What's OLD is NEW
Judge Dredd & The Worlds Of 2000AD
War of the Burning Sky
Level Up: Advanced 5E
Events & Releases
Upcoming Events
Private Events
Featured Events
Socials!
Twitch
YouTube
Facebook (EN Publishing)
Facebook (EN World)
Twitter
Instagram
TikTok
Podcast
Features
Top 5 RPGs Compiled Charts 2004-Present
Adventure Game Industry Market Research Summary (RPGs) V1.0
Ryan Dancey: Acquiring TSR
Q&A With Gary Gygax
D&D Rules FAQs
TSR, WotC, & Paizo: A Comparative History
D&D Pronunciation Guide
Million Dollar TTRPG Kickstarters
Tabletop RPG Podcast Hall of Fame
Eric Noah's Unofficial D&D 3rd Edition News
D&D in the Mainstream
D&D & RPG History
About Morrus
Log in
Register
What's new
Search
Search
Search titles only
By:
Forums & Topics
Forum List
Latest Posts
Forum list
*Dungeons & Dragons
Level Up: Advanced 5th Edition
D&D Older Editions
*TTRPGs General
*Pathfinder & Starfinder
EN Publishing
*Geek Talk & Media
Search forums
Chat/Discord
Menu
Log in
Register
Install the app
Install
The
VOIDRUNNER'S CODEX
is coming! Explore new worlds, fight oppressive empires, fend off fearsome aliens, and wield deadly psionics with this comprehensive boxed set expansion for 5E and A5E!
Community
General Tabletop Discussion
*Dungeons & Dragons
I feel like there is a problem with ability score bonuses.
JavaScript is disabled. For a better experience, please enable JavaScript in your browser before proceeding.
You are using an out of date browser. It may not display this or other websites correctly.
You should upgrade or use an
alternative browser
.
Reply to thread
Message
<blockquote data-quote="Saeviomagy" data-source="post: 7281798" data-attributes="member: 5890"><p>And in neither of them did adding a +1 modifier to an individual check really matter much if you still had to roll ~10 to succeed.</p><p></p><p>If I make a character from levels 1-4 in 5e, his stat modifier cannot make a difference as to whether he automatically succeeds at an easy task. I can't just say "I don't even need to roll". I can't make a plan and know that an aspect of it that relies on an <em>easy</em> thing to do is actually going to succeed. If I break the character generation rules and allocate a 20 to a stat, I can still only automatically succeed on that easy task if I play one of 3 classes.</p><p></p><p>If I make a character from levels 1-4 in 3e, ranks alone will make me succeed at easy tasks. Where I allocate my statistics will determine whether I can automatically succeed at moderate tasks.</p><p></p><p>Making success at something meaningful automatic is far, far more powerful than simply shifting probabilities from 25% chance of failure to 15% chance of failure.</p><p></p><p>You're creating a strawman here. Why is the fighter in your original example choosing cross-class skills? The 3e fighter had 2 (+int - oh look, another important non-class stat!) skills at 24. In 3e, that means if he's got a total of +5 other things (like a stat), he's automatically succeeding at heroic tasks, which seems appropriate for a 20th level character.</p><p></p><p>In 5e, he gets his +6 proficiency, +5 from a secondary stat... and guess what, he can succeed automatically at easy tasks. Yay! Heroic! As soon as he tries something moderate, he fails 20% of the time. Those aren't the sort of odds that you take if the result of failure is death.</p><p></p><p>Meanwhile the rogue with the same stat automatically succeeds at moderate tasks. Oh, wait, actually the rogue has an always-on take 10, so he actually automatically succeeds at very hard tasks.</p><p></p><p>5e panics about the possibility that a DM might let someone at high level with a good skill roll do awesome or impossible things so hard that it wrecks the curve at the low end, making skilled characters that are supposed to be the pinnacle of heroics be unable to confidently perform tasks like "noticing 6 drow tailing you in a dwarf city" or "recognise a shrine to a god" or "recognize weak stonework" according to the only real references we have.</p><p></p><p>And because of that, it doesn't really matter what your stats are, because it only bumps some numbers about a few percent.</p></blockquote><p></p>
[QUOTE="Saeviomagy, post: 7281798, member: 5890"] And in neither of them did adding a +1 modifier to an individual check really matter much if you still had to roll ~10 to succeed. If I make a character from levels 1-4 in 5e, his stat modifier cannot make a difference as to whether he automatically succeeds at an easy task. I can't just say "I don't even need to roll". I can't make a plan and know that an aspect of it that relies on an [i]easy[/i] thing to do is actually going to succeed. If I break the character generation rules and allocate a 20 to a stat, I can still only automatically succeed on that easy task if I play one of 3 classes. If I make a character from levels 1-4 in 3e, ranks alone will make me succeed at easy tasks. Where I allocate my statistics will determine whether I can automatically succeed at moderate tasks. Making success at something meaningful automatic is far, far more powerful than simply shifting probabilities from 25% chance of failure to 15% chance of failure. You're creating a strawman here. Why is the fighter in your original example choosing cross-class skills? The 3e fighter had 2 (+int - oh look, another important non-class stat!) skills at 24. In 3e, that means if he's got a total of +5 other things (like a stat), he's automatically succeeding at heroic tasks, which seems appropriate for a 20th level character. In 5e, he gets his +6 proficiency, +5 from a secondary stat... and guess what, he can succeed automatically at easy tasks. Yay! Heroic! As soon as he tries something moderate, he fails 20% of the time. Those aren't the sort of odds that you take if the result of failure is death. Meanwhile the rogue with the same stat automatically succeeds at moderate tasks. Oh, wait, actually the rogue has an always-on take 10, so he actually automatically succeeds at very hard tasks. 5e panics about the possibility that a DM might let someone at high level with a good skill roll do awesome or impossible things so hard that it wrecks the curve at the low end, making skilled characters that are supposed to be the pinnacle of heroics be unable to confidently perform tasks like "noticing 6 drow tailing you in a dwarf city" or "recognise a shrine to a god" or "recognize weak stonework" according to the only real references we have. And because of that, it doesn't really matter what your stats are, because it only bumps some numbers about a few percent. [/QUOTE]
Insert quotes…
Verification
Post reply
Community
General Tabletop Discussion
*Dungeons & Dragons
I feel like there is a problem with ability score bonuses.
Top