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<blockquote data-quote="Anubis" data-source="post: 679899" data-attributes="member: 2358"><p>UK, sorry to do this, but I still have to point out some obvious flaws in your system regarding lower levels.</p><p></p><p>I point you to the bugbear, CR 2 by the book, CR 2.2 by your system. Your system would also suggest that a single bugbear is an EL 5 encounter. Um, sorry, but that is OBVIOUSLY not the case. A standard level 1 party could defeat a bugbear with only minor difficulty. In fact, the ONLY current CR 2 monsters worthy of an EL 5 mark are the ogre and the loxo, and I think even they are only a 3 or 4.</p><p></p><p>I still think messing with the lower levels is a bad idea.</p><p></p><p>I also think that taking the rolles ability scores into consideration for purposes of determining PEL is pedantic and unnecessary. Where do you draw the line? What happens when a bull's strength spell is cast on the character? Does he suddenly rise up in his EL? NO. Duh. The actual levels take ALL of this into account to begin with, which is why you gain no XP for summoned creatures as well.</p><p></p><p>What about permanent magical items such as a belt of giant strength?</p><p></p><p>Basically, you're "double-taxing" this stuff. Level accounts for wealth which accounts for the magical items, and level and race account for ability scores. I do think that "above the norm" ability scores for other various races (such as Str+10 for the ogre) should be taken into account, but ONLY when determining ECL for purposes of character level.</p><p></p><p>Also, XP should NOT be gained by EL, but by each creature's individual CR, otherwise you're screwing PCs out of XP. EL works for matched encounters because the XP is the same anyway, but for mixed, it does not work at all. Take your example in that PDF with the pit fiends, gelugons, and dragon. The example puts it at EL 24. For a PEL 20, that nets 24000 XP. If, however, you do it the RIGHT way and determine XP per monster, the XP award is actually 31000. That 7000 can make a huge difference, ya' know. Or is your purpose actually to prevent effective level gaining as per the rules?</p><p></p><p>Methinks you should rethink some of this stuff. As it stands, I'm not sure how to incorporate the good parts of your system (the ELs over 20 and other such things) without using the parts that are obviously flawed as much as the core rules. Perhaps you could enlighten me on these.</p><p></p><p>(On a side note, ECL can be determined by your current tables and done as a simple permanent modifier to character, so problem solved there. But that still makes a big problem with normal races.)</p></blockquote><p></p>
[QUOTE="Anubis, post: 679899, member: 2358"] UK, sorry to do this, but I still have to point out some obvious flaws in your system regarding lower levels. I point you to the bugbear, CR 2 by the book, CR 2.2 by your system. Your system would also suggest that a single bugbear is an EL 5 encounter. Um, sorry, but that is OBVIOUSLY not the case. A standard level 1 party could defeat a bugbear with only minor difficulty. In fact, the ONLY current CR 2 monsters worthy of an EL 5 mark are the ogre and the loxo, and I think even they are only a 3 or 4. I still think messing with the lower levels is a bad idea. I also think that taking the rolles ability scores into consideration for purposes of determining PEL is pedantic and unnecessary. Where do you draw the line? What happens when a bull's strength spell is cast on the character? Does he suddenly rise up in his EL? NO. Duh. The actual levels take ALL of this into account to begin with, which is why you gain no XP for summoned creatures as well. What about permanent magical items such as a belt of giant strength? Basically, you're "double-taxing" this stuff. Level accounts for wealth which accounts for the magical items, and level and race account for ability scores. I do think that "above the norm" ability scores for other various races (such as Str+10 for the ogre) should be taken into account, but ONLY when determining ECL for purposes of character level. Also, XP should NOT be gained by EL, but by each creature's individual CR, otherwise you're screwing PCs out of XP. EL works for matched encounters because the XP is the same anyway, but for mixed, it does not work at all. Take your example in that PDF with the pit fiends, gelugons, and dragon. The example puts it at EL 24. For a PEL 20, that nets 24000 XP. If, however, you do it the RIGHT way and determine XP per monster, the XP award is actually 31000. That 7000 can make a huge difference, ya' know. Or is your purpose actually to prevent effective level gaining as per the rules? Methinks you should rethink some of this stuff. As it stands, I'm not sure how to incorporate the good parts of your system (the ELs over 20 and other such things) without using the parts that are obviously flawed as much as the core rules. Perhaps you could enlighten me on these. (On a side note, ECL can be determined by your current tables and done as a simple permanent modifier to character, so problem solved there. But that still makes a big problem with normal races.) [/QUOTE]
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