Menu
News
All News
Dungeons & Dragons
Level Up: Advanced 5th Edition
Pathfinder
Starfinder
Warhammer
2d20 System
Year Zero Engine
Industry News
Reviews
Dragon Reflections
Columns
Weekly Digests
Weekly News Digest
Freebies, Sales & Bundles
RPG Print News
RPG Crowdfunding News
Game Content
ENterplanetary DimENsions
Mythological Figures
Opinion
Worlds of Design
Peregrine's Next
RPG Evolution
Other Columns
From the Freelancing Frontline
Monster ENcyclopedia
WotC/TSR Alumni Look Back
4 Hours w/RSD (Ryan Dancey)
The Road to 3E (Jonathan Tweet)
Greenwood's Realms (Ed Greenwood)
Drawmij's TSR (Jim Ward)
Community
Forums & Topics
Forum List
Latest Posts
Forum list
*Dungeons & Dragons
Level Up: Advanced 5th Edition
D&D Older Editions
*TTRPGs General
*Pathfinder & Starfinder
EN Publishing
*Geek Talk & Media
Search forums
Chat/Discord
Resources
Wiki
Pages
Latest activity
Media
New media
New comments
Search media
Downloads
Latest reviews
Search resources
EN Publishing
Store
EN5ider
Adventures in ZEITGEIST
Awfully Cheerful Engine
What's OLD is NEW
Judge Dredd & The Worlds Of 2000AD
War of the Burning Sky
Level Up: Advanced 5E
Events & Releases
Upcoming Events
Private Events
Featured Events
Socials!
Twitch
YouTube
Facebook (EN Publishing)
Facebook (EN World)
Twitter
Instagram
TikTok
Podcast
Features
Top 5 RPGs Compiled Charts 2004-Present
Adventure Game Industry Market Research Summary (RPGs) V1.0
Ryan Dancey: Acquiring TSR
Q&A With Gary Gygax
D&D Rules FAQs
TSR, WotC, & Paizo: A Comparative History
D&D Pronunciation Guide
Million Dollar TTRPG Kickstarters
Tabletop RPG Podcast Hall of Fame
Eric Noah's Unofficial D&D 3rd Edition News
D&D in the Mainstream
D&D & RPG History
About Morrus
Log in
Register
What's new
Search
Search
Search titles only
By:
Forums & Topics
Forum List
Latest Posts
Forum list
*Dungeons & Dragons
Level Up: Advanced 5th Edition
D&D Older Editions
*TTRPGs General
*Pathfinder & Starfinder
EN Publishing
*Geek Talk & Media
Search forums
Chat/Discord
Menu
Log in
Register
Install the app
Install
The
VOIDRUNNER'S CODEX
is coming! Explore new worlds, fight oppressive empires, fend off fearsome aliens, and wield deadly psionics with this comprehensive boxed set expansion for 5E and A5E!
Community
General Tabletop Discussion
*Pathfinder & Starfinder
It’s LAUNCH DAY For The Pathfinder 2 Playtest!
JavaScript is disabled. For a better experience, please enable JavaScript in your browser before proceeding.
You are using an out of date browser. It may not display this or other websites correctly.
You should upgrade or use an
alternative browser
.
Reply to thread
Message
<blockquote data-quote="Arakasius" data-source="post: 7756481" data-attributes="member: 6944960"><p>They've said for longbows they are considering removing the volley feat and then give agile to shortbow. Which would make shortbow better for iterative attack classes, perhaps being a better choice for a class like Ranger. I can understand that even though the math pretty much works out the entire same between the 2 going the second way is better because it feels nicer to give a bonus to something than to give a penalty to something.</p><p></p><p>As for class balancing it has always relied on the premise that for some reason martial feats have rarely been exclusive while spells have always been exclusive. In 3.0-PF1 it was very easy for a caster class to take the martial's toys (because the pure class features of martials were so limited and were generally just static hit/damage bonuses) but impossible for the martials to do the same. And for 9th level spell casters (especially the 3/4 BAB ones) they all pretty much could make better optimized melee characters than the martials. Which was all part of LFQW. So here in PF2 they've gone and yes for now made martials caster like (with a protection over their class options to the same level that casters have over their spells) to protect their identity. </p><p></p><p>A wizard right now with no fighter feats just by taking a couple generalist feats (or ancestry feats) for armor/weapon access can make a very good gish without taking multiclassing. Since there is no 1/2 or 3/4 BAB anymore there is even more of a point to protecting the martial's toys. They've made it right now that regardless of your class you can make your class good at physical attacking just by allocating your abilities there. So the question then is why are casters allowed to protect their turf (and have a class identity) but martials are not? I can see some basic things being moved into the general pool but move to much and its just every previous edition over again. What are martials allowed to get to call their own? PF1 tried doing it with hit/dmg static bonuses and that didn't work. I suspect in the end some basic combat feats move to general but 80% of what are class specific feats for combat maneuvers/options still remain class specific with a significant cost to opting in to. (aka archetyping)</p></blockquote><p></p>
[QUOTE="Arakasius, post: 7756481, member: 6944960"] They've said for longbows they are considering removing the volley feat and then give agile to shortbow. Which would make shortbow better for iterative attack classes, perhaps being a better choice for a class like Ranger. I can understand that even though the math pretty much works out the entire same between the 2 going the second way is better because it feels nicer to give a bonus to something than to give a penalty to something. As for class balancing it has always relied on the premise that for some reason martial feats have rarely been exclusive while spells have always been exclusive. In 3.0-PF1 it was very easy for a caster class to take the martial's toys (because the pure class features of martials were so limited and were generally just static hit/damage bonuses) but impossible for the martials to do the same. And for 9th level spell casters (especially the 3/4 BAB ones) they all pretty much could make better optimized melee characters than the martials. Which was all part of LFQW. So here in PF2 they've gone and yes for now made martials caster like (with a protection over their class options to the same level that casters have over their spells) to protect their identity. A wizard right now with no fighter feats just by taking a couple generalist feats (or ancestry feats) for armor/weapon access can make a very good gish without taking multiclassing. Since there is no 1/2 or 3/4 BAB anymore there is even more of a point to protecting the martial's toys. They've made it right now that regardless of your class you can make your class good at physical attacking just by allocating your abilities there. So the question then is why are casters allowed to protect their turf (and have a class identity) but martials are not? I can see some basic things being moved into the general pool but move to much and its just every previous edition over again. What are martials allowed to get to call their own? PF1 tried doing it with hit/dmg static bonuses and that didn't work. I suspect in the end some basic combat feats move to general but 80% of what are class specific feats for combat maneuvers/options still remain class specific with a significant cost to opting in to. (aka archetyping) [/QUOTE]
Insert quotes…
Verification
Post reply
Community
General Tabletop Discussion
*Pathfinder & Starfinder
It’s LAUNCH DAY For The Pathfinder 2 Playtest!
Top