Menu
News
All News
Dungeons & Dragons
Level Up: Advanced 5th Edition
Pathfinder
Starfinder
Warhammer
2d20 System
Year Zero Engine
Industry News
Reviews
Dragon Reflections
Columns
Weekly Digests
Weekly News Digest
Freebies, Sales & Bundles
RPG Print News
RPG Crowdfunding News
Game Content
ENterplanetary DimENsions
Mythological Figures
Opinion
Worlds of Design
Peregrine's Next
RPG Evolution
Other Columns
From the Freelancing Frontline
Monster ENcyclopedia
WotC/TSR Alumni Look Back
4 Hours w/RSD (Ryan Dancey)
The Road to 3E (Jonathan Tweet)
Greenwood's Realms (Ed Greenwood)
Drawmij's TSR (Jim Ward)
Community
Forums & Topics
Forum List
Latest Posts
Forum list
*Dungeons & Dragons
Level Up: Advanced 5th Edition
D&D Older Editions
*TTRPGs General
*Pathfinder & Starfinder
EN Publishing
*Geek Talk & Media
Search forums
Chat/Discord
Resources
Wiki
Pages
Latest activity
Media
New media
New comments
Search media
Downloads
Latest reviews
Search resources
EN Publishing
Store
EN5ider
Adventures in ZEITGEIST
Awfully Cheerful Engine
What's OLD is NEW
Judge Dredd & The Worlds Of 2000AD
War of the Burning Sky
Level Up: Advanced 5E
Events & Releases
Upcoming Events
Private Events
Featured Events
Socials!
Twitch
YouTube
Facebook (EN Publishing)
Facebook (EN World)
Twitter
Instagram
TikTok
Podcast
Features
Top 5 RPGs Compiled Charts 2004-Present
Adventure Game Industry Market Research Summary (RPGs) V1.0
Ryan Dancey: Acquiring TSR
Q&A With Gary Gygax
D&D Rules FAQs
TSR, WotC, & Paizo: A Comparative History
D&D Pronunciation Guide
Million Dollar TTRPG Kickstarters
Tabletop RPG Podcast Hall of Fame
Eric Noah's Unofficial D&D 3rd Edition News
D&D in the Mainstream
D&D & RPG History
About Morrus
Log in
Register
What's new
Search
Search
Search titles only
By:
Forums & Topics
Forum List
Latest Posts
Forum list
*Dungeons & Dragons
Level Up: Advanced 5th Edition
D&D Older Editions
*TTRPGs General
*Pathfinder & Starfinder
EN Publishing
*Geek Talk & Media
Search forums
Chat/Discord
Menu
Log in
Register
Install the app
Install
Community
General Tabletop Discussion
*TTRPGs General
It Ain't D&D Without...
JavaScript is disabled. For a better experience, please enable JavaScript in your browser before proceeding.
You are using an out of date browser. It may not display this or other websites correctly.
You should upgrade or use an
alternative browser
.
Reply to thread
Message
<blockquote data-quote="M.L. Martin" data-source="post: 5176237" data-attributes="member: 4086"><p>Hmm...</p><p></p><p> The 'core four'--fighter, mage, cleric, rogue--are essential, of course. I'd quite happily see a D&D without the cleric, but that chance was missed twenty years ago; at this point, there's just too much legacy.</p><p></p><p> Ranger and paladin follow close behind. The paladin is arguably a prestige class/paragon path/fighter-cleric template, but is an archetype I want in the game, and the ranger is nearly as core as the basic four. I might, however, give the paladin some of the cleric's 'warrior-priest' element and shift the cleric more towards a White Mage/4E invoker archetype.</p><p></p><p> Maybe my MERP and 2E influences are showing, but I'd like the bard in there. 'Magical music' would be only one of its potential paths, although with the 'people person' and 'jack of all trades' elements. </p><p></p><p> From 4E, I'd take the warlord (possibly renamed 'captain' or something that sounds less elite), for the 'non-magical healing' option it provides and because it fills another valuable fantasy archetype--the heroic 'leader of men'. Perhaps blend elements of the cavalier with it for a broader 'noble warrior' archetype.</p><p></p><p> Druid, monk and barbarian belong to the expansion material. Those classes have always had a flavor of the exotic, and thus should be left a bit more out of the core.</p><p></p><p> Warlock? Most decidedly not in the core. Any D&D I'm in charge of is going to have a bright shiny Epic/High Fantasy feel to it, and while there's room for the 'evil-curious' hero, it belongs in an expansion, not as a core class. <img src="data:image/gif;base64,R0lGODlhAQABAIAAAAAAAP///yH5BAEAAAAALAAAAAABAAEAAAIBRAA7" class="smilie smilie--sprite smilie--sprite2" alt=";)" title="Wink ;)" loading="lazy" data-shortname=";)" /></p><p></p><p> The sorcerer and illusionist both belong in a magic expansion book, along with the other specialist mages. The swordmage or something like it, however, merits core status to fill the 'warrior mage' niche. </p><p></p><p> So, we wind up with:</p><p> Fighter</p><p> Ranger</p><p> Paladin (possibly with a bit more magical oomph than previously--probably something that looks a lot like the 4E paladin, really)</p><p> 'Captain'/Warlord</p><p> Mage</p><p> Swordmage/'Warrior Mage'</p><p> Cleric</p><p> Rogue</p><p> Bard</p></blockquote><p></p>
[QUOTE="M.L. Martin, post: 5176237, member: 4086"] Hmm... The 'core four'--fighter, mage, cleric, rogue--are essential, of course. I'd quite happily see a D&D without the cleric, but that chance was missed twenty years ago; at this point, there's just too much legacy. Ranger and paladin follow close behind. The paladin is arguably a prestige class/paragon path/fighter-cleric template, but is an archetype I want in the game, and the ranger is nearly as core as the basic four. I might, however, give the paladin some of the cleric's 'warrior-priest' element and shift the cleric more towards a White Mage/4E invoker archetype. Maybe my MERP and 2E influences are showing, but I'd like the bard in there. 'Magical music' would be only one of its potential paths, although with the 'people person' and 'jack of all trades' elements. From 4E, I'd take the warlord (possibly renamed 'captain' or something that sounds less elite), for the 'non-magical healing' option it provides and because it fills another valuable fantasy archetype--the heroic 'leader of men'. Perhaps blend elements of the cavalier with it for a broader 'noble warrior' archetype. Druid, monk and barbarian belong to the expansion material. Those classes have always had a flavor of the exotic, and thus should be left a bit more out of the core. Warlock? Most decidedly not in the core. Any D&D I'm in charge of is going to have a bright shiny Epic/High Fantasy feel to it, and while there's room for the 'evil-curious' hero, it belongs in an expansion, not as a core class. ;) The sorcerer and illusionist both belong in a magic expansion book, along with the other specialist mages. The swordmage or something like it, however, merits core status to fill the 'warrior mage' niche. So, we wind up with: Fighter Ranger Paladin (possibly with a bit more magical oomph than previously--probably something that looks a lot like the 4E paladin, really) 'Captain'/Warlord Mage Swordmage/'Warrior Mage' Cleric Rogue Bard [/QUOTE]
Insert quotes…
Verification
Post reply
Community
General Tabletop Discussion
*TTRPGs General
It Ain't D&D Without...
Top