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It's all Jack Vance's fault
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<blockquote data-quote="Ruin Explorer" data-source="post: 8805081" data-attributes="member: 18"><p>I'm sorry, but I did explain. See below:</p><p></p><p></p><p></p><p>So just to be clear, unless we explain an <em>entire</em> spell-point system, with examples, from the ground up, you're not interested? But it's okay for you to make a couple of flip assertions about spell-point systems, you don't need to do the same? Or am I misunderstanding? I'm hoping I'm misunderstanding.</p><p></p><p>I mean, I'd know what you meant, and it's relatively easy to explain the difference. You seem to asking for rather more than that re: magic systems.</p><p></p><p>In broad terms, spell point systems have a lot of variables you can tweak.</p><p></p><p>1) How deep the pool is relative to the cost of the spells.</p><p></p><p>You could have a very deep pool, which is effectively same as all the maximum possible slots a caster of X level in D&D could cast right now, or could go for really any depth less than that. Going for the "full depth" is unlikely to be balanced, because realistically, most casters end the day with a lot of spells uncast, and the flexibility of pools needs to be accounted for.</p><p></p><p>2) How the spells are costed relative to their power. If you wanted D&D-style spells, you could choose a wide variety of different cost models.</p><p></p><p>3) How the spells work and scale.</p><p></p><p>4) How many spells you know/have access to.</p><p></p><p>5) When and how the pool refreshes. Does it refresh constantly? On a Short Rest? Every X hours? On a Long Rest? These all require different balancing/design concerns.</p><p></p><p>The issue we've seen typically in D&D is that most spell-point systems presented in official work are extremely low-effort things not intended to be used, and with apparently little/no effort being made to balance them. In professional 3PP products, a better job is sometimes done. Homebrew systems run the gamut, but most people homebrewing are indeed amateurs with little grasp on (and often little interest in) balance or preventing exploits, because they're intending to just house-rule out exploits.</p><p></p><p>If you want to be educated about TTRPG magic systems, we can do that, it's a lot of work but it can be done, but here's my issue with asking for that. In my experience, when a person asks to be educated about a certain thing, in a post, online, approximately 80% of the time, unless they're extremely positive, they either:</p><p></p><p>A) Just leave the thread, and never show any evidence of having read what they asked for.</p><p></p><p>or</p><p></p><p>B) Literally ignore the post(s) with all the information in, and just try to nitpick some unrelated point.</p><p></p><p>So essentially asking to educated tends to turn into a form of trolling. I'm not saying you're doing that or intend to do it, but I am leery of putting a lot of effort into in-depth explanations of magic systems because I've been burned this way before. It's often not entirely useless - often someone else finds value in it, but it is a little vexing.</p><p></p><p>What spell point systems are you basing this assertion on? There are ones which have this flaw, but you can design shallower pools and steeper spell costs, or just redesign specific spells to prevent this being an issue.</p></blockquote><p></p>
[QUOTE="Ruin Explorer, post: 8805081, member: 18"] I'm sorry, but I did explain. See below: So just to be clear, unless we explain an [I]entire[/I] spell-point system, with examples, from the ground up, you're not interested? But it's okay for you to make a couple of flip assertions about spell-point systems, you don't need to do the same? Or am I misunderstanding? I'm hoping I'm misunderstanding. I mean, I'd know what you meant, and it's relatively easy to explain the difference. You seem to asking for rather more than that re: magic systems. In broad terms, spell point systems have a lot of variables you can tweak. 1) How deep the pool is relative to the cost of the spells. You could have a very deep pool, which is effectively same as all the maximum possible slots a caster of X level in D&D could cast right now, or could go for really any depth less than that. Going for the "full depth" is unlikely to be balanced, because realistically, most casters end the day with a lot of spells uncast, and the flexibility of pools needs to be accounted for. 2) How the spells are costed relative to their power. If you wanted D&D-style spells, you could choose a wide variety of different cost models. 3) How the spells work and scale. 4) How many spells you know/have access to. 5) When and how the pool refreshes. Does it refresh constantly? On a Short Rest? Every X hours? On a Long Rest? These all require different balancing/design concerns. The issue we've seen typically in D&D is that most spell-point systems presented in official work are extremely low-effort things not intended to be used, and with apparently little/no effort being made to balance them. In professional 3PP products, a better job is sometimes done. Homebrew systems run the gamut, but most people homebrewing are indeed amateurs with little grasp on (and often little interest in) balance or preventing exploits, because they're intending to just house-rule out exploits. If you want to be educated about TTRPG magic systems, we can do that, it's a lot of work but it can be done, but here's my issue with asking for that. In my experience, when a person asks to be educated about a certain thing, in a post, online, approximately 80% of the time, unless they're extremely positive, they either: A) Just leave the thread, and never show any evidence of having read what they asked for. or B) Literally ignore the post(s) with all the information in, and just try to nitpick some unrelated point. So essentially asking to educated tends to turn into a form of trolling. I'm not saying you're doing that or intend to do it, but I am leery of putting a lot of effort into in-depth explanations of magic systems because I've been burned this way before. It's often not entirely useless - often someone else finds value in it, but it is a little vexing. What spell point systems are you basing this assertion on? There are ones which have this flaw, but you can design shallower pools and steeper spell costs, or just redesign specific spells to prevent this being an issue. [/QUOTE]
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