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I've introduced my 5th ed group to AD&D 2E
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<blockquote data-quote="Orius" data-source="post: 8706676" data-attributes="member: 8863"><p>Oh yeah, pre-3e thieves suck. They suck at combat, and at low levels they're terrible at picking locks, disarming traps and pretty much anything else they're supposed to be good at. Then there's the issues with backstab, where everything is vague and left up to the DM, who's usually advised to take the most restrictive approach possible. Even allowing generous backstabbing, the damage output really isn't that impressive. The 3e rogue was a huge improvement in every way.</p><p></p><p></p><p></p><p>Tell me about it. I might not take the same specific approaches you would but for me fixing the things I want to fix in 2e would push things close enough to 3e that I might as well just use 3e. It's less work to ban 3e's most egregious crap, limit available options, and tweak a few other things than to hammer out 2e's legacy problems, work out the inconsistencies, and reconcile the differences where certain parts of the rules have multiple independent systems.</p><p></p><p>I already use some 3e elements in my current 2e game. First off, initiative. I had some combat planning sheets that I used in an earlier 3e campaign that I grabbed to use in the game before remembering that 2e's initiative system was different. But modern D&D initiative works well enough for 2e that I kept it. Then I switched to 3e's healing amounts though I kept the 2e levels for the spells. It makes them a bit more potent, and the party cleric doesn't need to load up on a ton of heals. I do 3e critical hits too, except without the specialized crit ranges or multipliers though I think crits are too powerful for 2e.</p><p></p><p>Oh and ascending AC. I've been using that since it got previewed in Dragon as an upcoming feature of 3e in late 1999. THAC0 itself isn't bad, it's just that using subtraction on the fly is less intuitive than addition.</p></blockquote><p></p>
[QUOTE="Orius, post: 8706676, member: 8863"] Oh yeah, pre-3e thieves suck. They suck at combat, and at low levels they're terrible at picking locks, disarming traps and pretty much anything else they're supposed to be good at. Then there's the issues with backstab, where everything is vague and left up to the DM, who's usually advised to take the most restrictive approach possible. Even allowing generous backstabbing, the damage output really isn't that impressive. The 3e rogue was a huge improvement in every way. Tell me about it. I might not take the same specific approaches you would but for me fixing the things I want to fix in 2e would push things close enough to 3e that I might as well just use 3e. It's less work to ban 3e's most egregious crap, limit available options, and tweak a few other things than to hammer out 2e's legacy problems, work out the inconsistencies, and reconcile the differences where certain parts of the rules have multiple independent systems. I already use some 3e elements in my current 2e game. First off, initiative. I had some combat planning sheets that I used in an earlier 3e campaign that I grabbed to use in the game before remembering that 2e's initiative system was different. But modern D&D initiative works well enough for 2e that I kept it. Then I switched to 3e's healing amounts though I kept the 2e levels for the spells. It makes them a bit more potent, and the party cleric doesn't need to load up on a ton of heals. I do 3e critical hits too, except without the specialized crit ranges or multipliers though I think crits are too powerful for 2e. Oh and ascending AC. I've been using that since it got previewed in Dragon as an upcoming feature of 3e in late 1999. THAC0 itself isn't bad, it's just that using subtraction on the fly is less intuitive than addition. [/QUOTE]
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