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Legends and Lore July 28: Keeping it Classy
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<blockquote data-quote="Ruin Explorer" data-source="post: 6345050" data-attributes="member: 18"><p>That's problematic, though, Mouse, because new subclasses can only be used by new PCs.</p><p></p><p>It's the same as the background issue, only worse. With a background, it's cool, but it's a choice you make once, and cannot ever make again. It's the same (AFAIK!) with sub-classes, but at least they keep on giving you stuff as you go on.</p><p></p><p>Whereas Feats and potentially PrCs or similar can be applied to existing characters - I'm pretty sure this is why books which included such things were such big sellers in the 3.XE era, whereas books which focused on new races or base classes tended to be a bit less successful (relative to investment). Entirely my perception, of course!</p><p></p><p>So if they're the "primary" player-focused mechanical thing, then I think that might be an issue. Though perhaps we'll all just keep creating new PCs, who knows?</p><p></p><p></p><p></p><p>I just read through Warlock to see if I was missing anything, but it looks like whilst Blade Pact can easily get 2 attacks, they can't really get ANYTHING else which supports melee'ing. They have light armour or Mage Armour (equivalent to light armour), no shield (AFAIK), no way to get bonus melee damage (unlike even Clerics!) beyond STAT mod, no special manuevers, no ability to cast and attack, and generally no way to make melee a particularly good option. So they strike me as more like the flipside of the Eldritch Knight - really strong on magic, with an option to tack on a tiny bit of melee (actually less than the EK can tack on, magic-wise). And you'd pretty much need a really good DEX and a finesse-based weapon (STR would be kind of a waste as it wouldn't help your AC or anything).</p><p></p><p>I dunno, am I missing something? Eldritch Blast is pretty much always as good or better than hitting something with a sword, if you aren't already in melee - 120' range (no range penalties - much longer than most ranged weapons), 1d10 damage, +CHA if you take the option (which you probably should if intending to use it much), get 2 attacks with it at 5, 3 at 10, 4 at 20 (kind of better progression than a Fighter! That thing seems pretty badass.</p></blockquote><p></p>
[QUOTE="Ruin Explorer, post: 6345050, member: 18"] That's problematic, though, Mouse, because new subclasses can only be used by new PCs. It's the same as the background issue, only worse. With a background, it's cool, but it's a choice you make once, and cannot ever make again. It's the same (AFAIK!) with sub-classes, but at least they keep on giving you stuff as you go on. Whereas Feats and potentially PrCs or similar can be applied to existing characters - I'm pretty sure this is why books which included such things were such big sellers in the 3.XE era, whereas books which focused on new races or base classes tended to be a bit less successful (relative to investment). Entirely my perception, of course! So if they're the "primary" player-focused mechanical thing, then I think that might be an issue. Though perhaps we'll all just keep creating new PCs, who knows? I just read through Warlock to see if I was missing anything, but it looks like whilst Blade Pact can easily get 2 attacks, they can't really get ANYTHING else which supports melee'ing. They have light armour or Mage Armour (equivalent to light armour), no shield (AFAIK), no way to get bonus melee damage (unlike even Clerics!) beyond STAT mod, no special manuevers, no ability to cast and attack, and generally no way to make melee a particularly good option. So they strike me as more like the flipside of the Eldritch Knight - really strong on magic, with an option to tack on a tiny bit of melee (actually less than the EK can tack on, magic-wise). And you'd pretty much need a really good DEX and a finesse-based weapon (STR would be kind of a waste as it wouldn't help your AC or anything). I dunno, am I missing something? Eldritch Blast is pretty much always as good or better than hitting something with a sword, if you aren't already in melee - 120' range (no range penalties - much longer than most ranged weapons), 1d10 damage, +CHA if you take the option (which you probably should if intending to use it much), get 2 attacks with it at 5, 3 at 10, 4 at 20 (kind of better progression than a Fighter! That thing seems pretty badass. [/QUOTE]
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