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<blockquote data-quote="I'm A Banana" data-source="post: 5677773" data-attributes="member: 2067"><p>A game that largely consists of a facilitator "taking things into account while adjudicating situations" is unfulfilling to me as a player and tedious to me as a DM.</p><p></p><p>There's always going to be some adjudication and wiggle room, and that's part of what makes the game good. But for me, that's not something to <strong>rely on</strong>. I don't want rules that just say: "Meh. Whatever you feel like."</p><p></p><p>Let's give a more concrete example: the 4e NPC design rules are explicitly housed in DM Fiat. What you expect the NPC to do determines what ruleset you use to stat them up, from "nothing" for NPC's that are just verbal to "monster stats" for NPC's that are going to be faught to "optional companion rules" if they're going to be party allies.</p><p></p><p>These rules fail for me, since I don't want to have to decide for my players how they can use a given NPC. They require too much adjudication. I'd much rather give them a concrete rules element, and have them do whatever they feel like to it. </p><p></p><p>Mearls's proposed skill rules also require too much adjudication for me. I don't want to have to make a judgement call about which of 5 or 6 different difficulty categories a given activity falls into. I want to be able to simply present a situation, and achieve a reaction. </p><p></p><p>A game that relies too much on DM adjudication is not fun for me. </p><p></p><p>The key, of course, is "too much," and that's going to vary from table to table. Good DMs (or when you're DMing in your zone) can do whatever they want and get away with it. Everyone else needs rules.</p><p></p><p></p><p></p><p>You're setting up a false dichotomy. I have noted that it's a matter of degrees a few times, now. </p><p></p><p>More specifically, we have a very different conception of what a rule is. Rather than a prohibition, I see a game's rule as a tool to be used to achieve a goal. "Roll 1d20 + modifiers vs. AC to hit" is a rule that is used to achieve victory in combat.</p><p></p><p>Now, you don't need that tool, necessarily. You can just say "I jab my sword in between the plates in the knight's armor!" and have a DM adjudicate the result. </p><p></p><p>But I think I've been pretty clear in pointing out why, for me, that is a deeply unsatisfying way to play the game. </p><p></p><p>The mere existence of intricate combat rules in every D&D edition speaks to the fact that rules are not necessarily reductive -- they contain all the chaos of twelve or so people trying to kill each other. They are abstract, but that's different.</p></blockquote><p></p>
[QUOTE="I'm A Banana, post: 5677773, member: 2067"] A game that largely consists of a facilitator "taking things into account while adjudicating situations" is unfulfilling to me as a player and tedious to me as a DM. There's always going to be some adjudication and wiggle room, and that's part of what makes the game good. But for me, that's not something to [B]rely on[/B]. I don't want rules that just say: "Meh. Whatever you feel like." Let's give a more concrete example: the 4e NPC design rules are explicitly housed in DM Fiat. What you expect the NPC to do determines what ruleset you use to stat them up, from "nothing" for NPC's that are just verbal to "monster stats" for NPC's that are going to be faught to "optional companion rules" if they're going to be party allies. These rules fail for me, since I don't want to have to decide for my players how they can use a given NPC. They require too much adjudication. I'd much rather give them a concrete rules element, and have them do whatever they feel like to it. Mearls's proposed skill rules also require too much adjudication for me. I don't want to have to make a judgement call about which of 5 or 6 different difficulty categories a given activity falls into. I want to be able to simply present a situation, and achieve a reaction. A game that relies too much on DM adjudication is not fun for me. The key, of course, is "too much," and that's going to vary from table to table. Good DMs (or when you're DMing in your zone) can do whatever they want and get away with it. Everyone else needs rules. You're setting up a false dichotomy. I have noted that it's a matter of degrees a few times, now. More specifically, we have a very different conception of what a rule is. Rather than a prohibition, I see a game's rule as a tool to be used to achieve a goal. "Roll 1d20 + modifiers vs. AC to hit" is a rule that is used to achieve victory in combat. Now, you don't need that tool, necessarily. You can just say "I jab my sword in between the plates in the knight's armor!" and have a DM adjudicate the result. But I think I've been pretty clear in pointing out why, for me, that is a deeply unsatisfying way to play the game. The mere existence of intricate combat rules in every D&D edition speaks to the fact that rules are not necessarily reductive -- they contain all the chaos of twelve or so people trying to kill each other. They are abstract, but that's different. [/QUOTE]
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