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MTOF: Elves are gender-swapping reincarnates and I am on board with it
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<blockquote data-quote="Sacrosanct" data-source="post: 7428685" data-attributes="member: 15700"><p>That actually started in the 70s, not 80s. But if you don't think rampant sexism, homophobia, and transphobia was much worse then than now, then you either weren't old enough to remember, or haven't opened a history book. Many of those artists dressed androgynous or feminine, but god forbid if they ever actually came out as gay or trans. It was viewed as just an act on stage and that's how people preferred to convince themselves. It seems obvious in hindsight that Boy George and Freddie Mercury are/were gay/bi now, but back then not only was it not admitted, it was hidden from the larger population. Heck, gay bars were still being raided by police in the 80s, and the new AIDS epidemic was thought to be a gays only disease, and every gay person had it and was gonna spread it to you. There was a real fear that a woman having a gay friend would get AIDS and that prejudice was horrible. Just go watch Eddie Murphy RAW to see how even the more liberal areas of pop culture treated LGBT.</p><p></p><p>So, back to the point, D&D openly saying that the main elven god was neither male nor female was a pretty big deal, and since it's been around since pretty much the beginning of D&D, this entire discussion about the elven lore being gender fluid is not counter to how elven lore has been since the beginning of D&D. I think you're confusing "pandering" with "acknowledging". </p><p></p><p>I'll be perfectly honest here. Every time I hear someone use words like "pandering" or "catering" or "bending to their agenda" just by simply acknowledging that these people exist, I immediately come to a negative conclusion about that person because that's not what those words mean, and it's a way to dismiss the legitimacy of the concerns of others.</p></blockquote><p></p>
[QUOTE="Sacrosanct, post: 7428685, member: 15700"] That actually started in the 70s, not 80s. But if you don't think rampant sexism, homophobia, and transphobia was much worse then than now, then you either weren't old enough to remember, or haven't opened a history book. Many of those artists dressed androgynous or feminine, but god forbid if they ever actually came out as gay or trans. It was viewed as just an act on stage and that's how people preferred to convince themselves. It seems obvious in hindsight that Boy George and Freddie Mercury are/were gay/bi now, but back then not only was it not admitted, it was hidden from the larger population. Heck, gay bars were still being raided by police in the 80s, and the new AIDS epidemic was thought to be a gays only disease, and every gay person had it and was gonna spread it to you. There was a real fear that a woman having a gay friend would get AIDS and that prejudice was horrible. Just go watch Eddie Murphy RAW to see how even the more liberal areas of pop culture treated LGBT. So, back to the point, D&D openly saying that the main elven god was neither male nor female was a pretty big deal, and since it's been around since pretty much the beginning of D&D, this entire discussion about the elven lore being gender fluid is not counter to how elven lore has been since the beginning of D&D. I think you're confusing "pandering" with "acknowledging". I'll be perfectly honest here. Every time I hear someone use words like "pandering" or "catering" or "bending to their agenda" just by simply acknowledging that these people exist, I immediately come to a negative conclusion about that person because that's not what those words mean, and it's a way to dismiss the legitimacy of the concerns of others. [/QUOTE]
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MTOF: Elves are gender-swapping reincarnates and I am on board with it
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