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General Tabletop Discussion
*Pathfinder & Starfinder
Multiclassing - decouple Class Levels and Character Levels?
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<blockquote data-quote="Geron Raveneye" data-source="post: 4180221" data-attributes="member: 2268"><p>I've been pondering on something that came up during a discussion about the problem of seeming level-equivalence with the current 3.X multiclassing system. It was inspired by the attempt to mix 2E and 3E multiclassing systems. Since I wouldn't be surprised if something like that has been done (and published) already, I'd appreciate pointers in the right direction by those in the know. <img src="data:image/gif;base64,R0lGODlhAQABAIAAAAAAAP///yH5BAEAAAAALAAAAAABAAEAAAIBRAA7" class="smilie smilie--sprite smilie--sprite1" alt=":)" title="Smile :)" loading="lazy" data-shortname=":)" /> </p><p></p><p>Of course, simple feedback is also welcome. <img src="data:image/gif;base64,R0lGODlhAQABAIAAAAAAAP///yH5BAEAAAAALAAAAAABAAEAAAIBRAA7" class="smilie smilie--sprite smilie--sprite2" alt=";)" title="Wink ;)" loading="lazy" data-shortname=";)" /> </p><p></p><p>The idea is as follows: XP gained are split between the classes of a multiclass character, and recorded separately in order to level up the character in each class separately. This determines the class level in each class the character trains in. The character level is calculated by the total XP the character gained, and is determined from the Level/XP chart as well.</p><p></p><p>Benefits are gained either by class level or by character level. Class level basically only grants you the special abilities of the class (bonus feats, sneak attack, spells, turning, etc) and the class skill list. Character level grants you hit points, BAB, Base Save, skill points etc. You use the best BAB and Base Save progression of the classes your character has trained in, hit points (or rather HD) are averaged between the classes, as are skill points. He gains all abilities (proficiencies with weapons and armor), but also suffers all limits of each class (weapon restrictions, alignments, casting in armor, etc).</p><p></p><p><em>Example: A multiclass fighter/wizard 5/5 who has split his XP 50/50 between both classes has gained 20000 XP during his career. He has 3 figher bonus feats, Summon Familiar, Scribe Scroll, a wizard bonus feat and the spell selection and casting ability of a 5th level wizard.</em></p><p><em>With 20000 XP, he is at 6th <strong>character level</strong>. His HD are the average of d10 and d4 (in this case, the d7, or d8-1 reroll 1s), so he got to roll that 6 times, adding Con modifiers as usual. He has 2 skill points + Int bonus per level (both classes only offer 2 + Int bonus), and his max skill ranks are +9/+4.5. He combines the class skill lists of both classes. He has Fort +4, Ref +1, Will +4 as his saves. He has all abilities of both classes, and abides by all restrictions of each.</em></p><p></p><p>The system would work with later multiclassing, too. Simply set a year of training time before the 1st level in a new class can be gained, and recalculate all character level dependent benefits. What is lacking gets filled up, and what is too much already gets frozen until the new values would overtake the old. A fighter 5th taking 1st level of rogue would gain a LOT of new class skills, and the difference in skill points between 2/level and 5/level (average of both classes) would be available as new skill points. On the other hand, his HP wouldn't rise until the new HD (d8 instead of d10) would overtake the difference.</p><p></p><p>So, is there something like that already out there? People using it? And if yes, what's the experience? I realize it is a bit more complicated, but I think it beats the problem of levels, since that way, a multiclass character with equal levels will stay only a few levels behind his group mates (5/5 = 6th, 8/8 = 11th, 14/14 = 19th), and will be able to contribute a lot better to any adventure while not being too overpowered (I think).</p><p></p><p>As I said, feedback appreciated. <img src="data:image/gif;base64,R0lGODlhAQABAIAAAAAAAP///yH5BAEAAAAALAAAAAABAAEAAAIBRAA7" class="smilie smilie--sprite smilie--sprite1" alt=":)" title="Smile :)" loading="lazy" data-shortname=":)" /></p></blockquote><p></p>
[QUOTE="Geron Raveneye, post: 4180221, member: 2268"] I've been pondering on something that came up during a discussion about the problem of seeming level-equivalence with the current 3.X multiclassing system. It was inspired by the attempt to mix 2E and 3E multiclassing systems. Since I wouldn't be surprised if something like that has been done (and published) already, I'd appreciate pointers in the right direction by those in the know. :) Of course, simple feedback is also welcome. ;) The idea is as follows: XP gained are split between the classes of a multiclass character, and recorded separately in order to level up the character in each class separately. This determines the class level in each class the character trains in. The character level is calculated by the total XP the character gained, and is determined from the Level/XP chart as well. Benefits are gained either by class level or by character level. Class level basically only grants you the special abilities of the class (bonus feats, sneak attack, spells, turning, etc) and the class skill list. Character level grants you hit points, BAB, Base Save, skill points etc. You use the best BAB and Base Save progression of the classes your character has trained in, hit points (or rather HD) are averaged between the classes, as are skill points. He gains all abilities (proficiencies with weapons and armor), but also suffers all limits of each class (weapon restrictions, alignments, casting in armor, etc). [i]Example: A multiclass fighter/wizard 5/5 who has split his XP 50/50 between both classes has gained 20000 XP during his career. He has 3 figher bonus feats, Summon Familiar, Scribe Scroll, a wizard bonus feat and the spell selection and casting ability of a 5th level wizard. With 20000 XP, he is at 6th [b]character level[/b]. His HD are the average of d10 and d4 (in this case, the d7, or d8-1 reroll 1s), so he got to roll that 6 times, adding Con modifiers as usual. He has 2 skill points + Int bonus per level (both classes only offer 2 + Int bonus), and his max skill ranks are +9/+4.5. He combines the class skill lists of both classes. He has Fort +4, Ref +1, Will +4 as his saves. He has all abilities of both classes, and abides by all restrictions of each.[/i] The system would work with later multiclassing, too. Simply set a year of training time before the 1st level in a new class can be gained, and recalculate all character level dependent benefits. What is lacking gets filled up, and what is too much already gets frozen until the new values would overtake the old. A fighter 5th taking 1st level of rogue would gain a LOT of new class skills, and the difference in skill points between 2/level and 5/level (average of both classes) would be available as new skill points. On the other hand, his HP wouldn't rise until the new HD (d8 instead of d10) would overtake the difference. So, is there something like that already out there? People using it? And if yes, what's the experience? I realize it is a bit more complicated, but I think it beats the problem of levels, since that way, a multiclass character with equal levels will stay only a few levels behind his group mates (5/5 = 6th, 8/8 = 11th, 14/14 = 19th), and will be able to contribute a lot better to any adventure while not being too overpowered (I think). As I said, feedback appreciated. :) [/QUOTE]
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