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<blockquote data-quote="Wyvern" data-source="post: 1290267" data-attributes="member: 2374"><p>A couple of points that need clarification:</p><p></p><p>First, a "steer a vehicle" action is a move-equivalent action, right? In 3.5, move-equivalent actions are referred to simply as move actions, regardless of whether they actually involve movement, and some move actions *do* provoke attacks of opportunity. So I'm not sure what you mean by saying that steering a vehicle is like a move action except that it provokes an AoO. Could it be that you have your terms confused?</p><p></p><p>Secondly, when you say that a "steer a vehicle" action provokes attacks of opportunity "as he starts to move", do you mean that the vehicle itself is subject to attacks of opportunity, or that the pilot is subject to AoO from opponents on the vehicle with him? If it's the former, I think that vehicles should be subject to the same rules for AoO as creatures: that is, sometimes they provoke AoO when they move, and sometimes they don't. If it's the latter (the pilot provokes AoO while steering), that makes sense, but then I'm left wondering what you mean by "as he starts to move," since the pilot isn't actually moving in the usual sense (rather, he's moving the vehicle that he's in).</p><p></p><p></p><p></p><p>I have an idea for a compromise solution. I don't know that it's any *simpler* than the current rule, but it may be more intuitive. My solution is this: A vehicle can travel up to 4x its base speed in a round (5x if the pilot has the Speed Demon feat). An uncontrolled vehicle continues to move in a straight line at its current speed (i.e. the speed at which it moved the previous round). A "steer a vehicle" action is needed to change a vehicle's speed or altitude, turn it, avoid a collision or perform a stunt, but not merely to move it. Thus, it's meaningless to talk about a "double move" for a vehicle, because a vehicle moves however far the pilot wants it to move in a round (within limits, of course) regardless of whether he makes one "steer a vehicle" action or two. Changing the speed of a vehicle is a move action with no check required. A pilot can also attempt to change speed while performing a stunt, but this adds a +5 to the DC of the stunt.</p><p></p><p>This also allows for an easy solution to the question of how to deal with acceleration. As an optional rule, a pilot can only increase or decrease a vehicle's speed by an amount equal to its base speed with one "steer a vehicle" action, unless the vehicle is specially equipped for fast acceleration, or unless he has the Speed Demon feat. Note that if he spends a full round accelerating or decelerating, he can modify the speed by up to twice the base speed. A medium or heavy cargo load affects a vehicle's base speed for the purpose of acceleration or deceleration, but not its maximum speed.</p><p></p><p>Wyvern</p><p></p><p>P.S. Glad to see you're still with us, barsoomcore! Happy New Year!</p></blockquote><p></p>
[QUOTE="Wyvern, post: 1290267, member: 2374"] A couple of points that need clarification: First, a "steer a vehicle" action is a move-equivalent action, right? In 3.5, move-equivalent actions are referred to simply as move actions, regardless of whether they actually involve movement, and some move actions *do* provoke attacks of opportunity. So I'm not sure what you mean by saying that steering a vehicle is like a move action except that it provokes an AoO. Could it be that you have your terms confused? Secondly, when you say that a "steer a vehicle" action provokes attacks of opportunity "as he starts to move", do you mean that the vehicle itself is subject to attacks of opportunity, or that the pilot is subject to AoO from opponents on the vehicle with him? If it's the former, I think that vehicles should be subject to the same rules for AoO as creatures: that is, sometimes they provoke AoO when they move, and sometimes they don't. If it's the latter (the pilot provokes AoO while steering), that makes sense, but then I'm left wondering what you mean by "as he starts to move," since the pilot isn't actually moving in the usual sense (rather, he's moving the vehicle that he's in). I have an idea for a compromise solution. I don't know that it's any *simpler* than the current rule, but it may be more intuitive. My solution is this: A vehicle can travel up to 4x its base speed in a round (5x if the pilot has the Speed Demon feat). An uncontrolled vehicle continues to move in a straight line at its current speed (i.e. the speed at which it moved the previous round). A "steer a vehicle" action is needed to change a vehicle's speed or altitude, turn it, avoid a collision or perform a stunt, but not merely to move it. Thus, it's meaningless to talk about a "double move" for a vehicle, because a vehicle moves however far the pilot wants it to move in a round (within limits, of course) regardless of whether he makes one "steer a vehicle" action or two. Changing the speed of a vehicle is a move action with no check required. A pilot can also attempt to change speed while performing a stunt, but this adds a +5 to the DC of the stunt. This also allows for an easy solution to the question of how to deal with acceleration. As an optional rule, a pilot can only increase or decrease a vehicle's speed by an amount equal to its base speed with one "steer a vehicle" action, unless the vehicle is specially equipped for fast acceleration, or unless he has the Speed Demon feat. Note that if he spends a full round accelerating or decelerating, he can modify the speed by up to twice the base speed. A medium or heavy cargo load affects a vehicle's base speed for the purpose of acceleration or deceleration, but not its maximum speed. Wyvern P.S. Glad to see you're still with us, barsoomcore! Happy New Year! [/QUOTE]
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