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Permanent Increases in Intelligence Question
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<blockquote data-quote="Greenfield" data-source="post: 7181007" data-attributes="member: 6669384"><p>I started to pick your summary apart (not that hard), and point out the mischaracterizations you included, but you said something that I realized was true.</p><p></p><p>I was being a troll, responding before I'd fully read your posts, and generally letting my adrenal system do my thinking for me.</p><p></p><p>I'm sorry. I went off topic just to prove you wrong about things, and i pounded on irrelevant points as if they meant something.</p><p></p><p>We disagree on this, and I don't think that's going to change. I still think you're hand waving opinions you don't like (as in "blah to all of that"), but I'd like to think we can disagree in a more civil manner.</p><p></p><p>So I'll start anew, on topic and civil this time.</p><p></p><p>I disagree with your idea because:</p><p></p><p>1) It doesn't handle the contra-case very well: INT loss. Agreed it's a rare thing, as even spells like Bestow Curse and Feeblemind aren't actually permanent.</p><p>2) The "ease of book keeping" you cite presumes a spreadsheet approach to calculating skills. That approach is notoriously poor when it comes to skills because it not only doesn't handle INT increases or decreases, it also has a hard time keeping track of in-class and out-of-class skills when someone changes classes.</p><p>3) Whether you use the word "retroactive" or not, that is what you're trying to rationalize, and it's a bad idea for both game balance and continuity.</p><p>4) You've come up with a partial answer to the question of how someone learned a skill, after the fact, but it comes across to me as a thin excuse. A "pay no attention to that rule behind the curtain" kind of thing. D&D has far too many of those already. (Comparing that to gaining Strength without working out is a bad idea though. Skill points are the product of the stat bump, while working to improve a stat is the cause.)</p><p></p><p>We could argue about what a 1 INT does or doesn't allow, or what house rules I do or don't use. I do use house rules, but I think that they should be approached carefully. I admit my prejudice against PC power-ups, which your rule seems to be designed to provide. But I don't think I'm wrong to advise that they should be handled carefully.</p><p></p><p>As I've said several times, if you're the DM you can implement any house rule you like. It's your game and that's fine. By the same token though, I'm free to disagree with you.</p></blockquote><p></p>
[QUOTE="Greenfield, post: 7181007, member: 6669384"] I started to pick your summary apart (not that hard), and point out the mischaracterizations you included, but you said something that I realized was true. I was being a troll, responding before I'd fully read your posts, and generally letting my adrenal system do my thinking for me. I'm sorry. I went off topic just to prove you wrong about things, and i pounded on irrelevant points as if they meant something. We disagree on this, and I don't think that's going to change. I still think you're hand waving opinions you don't like (as in "blah to all of that"), but I'd like to think we can disagree in a more civil manner. So I'll start anew, on topic and civil this time. I disagree with your idea because: 1) It doesn't handle the contra-case very well: INT loss. Agreed it's a rare thing, as even spells like Bestow Curse and Feeblemind aren't actually permanent. 2) The "ease of book keeping" you cite presumes a spreadsheet approach to calculating skills. That approach is notoriously poor when it comes to skills because it not only doesn't handle INT increases or decreases, it also has a hard time keeping track of in-class and out-of-class skills when someone changes classes. 3) Whether you use the word "retroactive" or not, that is what you're trying to rationalize, and it's a bad idea for both game balance and continuity. 4) You've come up with a partial answer to the question of how someone learned a skill, after the fact, but it comes across to me as a thin excuse. A "pay no attention to that rule behind the curtain" kind of thing. D&D has far too many of those already. (Comparing that to gaining Strength without working out is a bad idea though. Skill points are the product of the stat bump, while working to improve a stat is the cause.) We could argue about what a 1 INT does or doesn't allow, or what house rules I do or don't use. I do use house rules, but I think that they should be approached carefully. I admit my prejudice against PC power-ups, which your rule seems to be designed to provide. But I don't think I'm wrong to advise that they should be handled carefully. As I've said several times, if you're the DM you can implement any house rule you like. It's your game and that's fine. By the same token though, I'm free to disagree with you. [/QUOTE]
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