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<blockquote data-quote="Argyle King" data-source="post: 9300164" data-attributes="member: 58416"><p>After my earlier (some pages ago) questions about where shades of gray end and black begins, I had another thought that was influenced by others discussing how the game is marketed (and similar conversations about D&D elsewhere).</p><p></p><p>How dark do you prefer your evil? </p><p></p><p>There's quite a large gap between Dick Dastardly cheating to win Wacky Races and Baron Vladimir Harkonnen finding pleasure in physical assault.</p><p></p><p>Maybe a better question is to consider how much granularity you want in your morality. Are the black hats & white hats of a western movie good enough or do you prefer the complexities and shifting alliances of something like Shōgun?</p><p></p><p>For me, it depends upon my target audience. Game genre likely has an influence too. Running a swashbuckling adventure for children is something I would approach differently than if I were running a Dark Sun hexcrawl for some of my vet friends. </p><p></p><p>Which isn't to say that you can't run Dark Sun for kids; if I did, I would likely describe certain aspects in more-vague terms and "fade to black" much like how some movies handle implied things. I may do the same thing for a group of adults if neither myself nor the group felt the need to expound certain Shōgun?</p><p></p><p>My own preferences typically lean toward having some amount of granularity. "All orcs are evil" might be okay as a general rule of thumb for a short adventure, but I would find "most orcs are my enemy because they serve the BBEG, but individual leaders still have personal motivations" more interesting for a lengthier campaign. </p><p></p><p>Additional thoughts:</p><p></p><p>As a kid, I remember Cobra teaming up with GI Joe to oppose a drug cartel, so even a megalomaniacal leader (Cobra Commander) of a terrorist cell might have cause to be "good" under the right circumstances. </p><p></p><p>Given that this is in the general chat and not D&D, I think it's worth noting that D&D alignment often isn't how other games, movies, or stories do things. Certainly, there is value for using alignment as broad strokes to quickly categorize friend or foe. </p><p></p><p>However, I typically think more in terms of different factions (or individuals) having finer strokes that color in morals, beliefs, alliances, and enemies. This is something seen in many non-D&D games that I play: for example, GURPS has mental "disadvantages" to cover a sense of duty toward a group and includes things like "allies" that can be bought with points; Edge of the Empire (Star Wars) has -as part of creating a character- "obligation." </p><p></p><p>As well, video games such as Fallout, Skyrim, and even Baldur's Gate have more nuance in how exactly a character's morality plays out, and that influences how a character interacts with others. </p><p></p><p></p><p></p><p>TLDR:</p><p>How evil do you like your evil to be? </p><p>How much granularity do you prefer when it comes to painting morality?</p></blockquote><p></p>
[QUOTE="Argyle King, post: 9300164, member: 58416"] After my earlier (some pages ago) questions about where shades of gray end and black begins, I had another thought that was influenced by others discussing how the game is marketed (and similar conversations about D&D elsewhere). How dark do you prefer your evil? There's quite a large gap between Dick Dastardly cheating to win Wacky Races and Baron Vladimir Harkonnen finding pleasure in physical assault. Maybe a better question is to consider how much granularity you want in your morality. Are the black hats & white hats of a western movie good enough or do you prefer the complexities and shifting alliances of something like Shōgun? For me, it depends upon my target audience. Game genre likely has an influence too. Running a swashbuckling adventure for children is something I would approach differently than if I were running a Dark Sun hexcrawl for some of my vet friends. Which isn't to say that you can't run Dark Sun for kids; if I did, I would likely describe certain aspects in more-vague terms and "fade to black" much like how some movies handle implied things. I may do the same thing for a group of adults if neither myself nor the group felt the need to expound certain Shōgun? My own preferences typically lean toward having some amount of granularity. "All orcs are evil" might be okay as a general rule of thumb for a short adventure, but I would find "most orcs are my enemy because they serve the BBEG, but individual leaders still have personal motivations" more interesting for a lengthier campaign. Additional thoughts: As a kid, I remember Cobra teaming up with GI Joe to oppose a drug cartel, so even a megalomaniacal leader (Cobra Commander) of a terrorist cell might have cause to be "good" under the right circumstances. Given that this is in the general chat and not D&D, I think it's worth noting that D&D alignment often isn't how other games, movies, or stories do things. Certainly, there is value for using alignment as broad strokes to quickly categorize friend or foe. However, I typically think more in terms of different factions (or individuals) having finer strokes that color in morals, beliefs, alliances, and enemies. This is something seen in many non-D&D games that I play: for example, GURPS has mental "disadvantages" to cover a sense of duty toward a group and includes things like "allies" that can be bought with points; Edge of the Empire (Star Wars) has -as part of creating a character- "obligation." As well, video games such as Fallout, Skyrim, and even Baldur's Gate have more nuance in how exactly a character's morality plays out, and that influences how a character interacts with others. TLDR: How evil do you like your evil to be? How much granularity do you prefer when it comes to painting morality? [/QUOTE]
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