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<blockquote data-quote="pemerton" data-source="post: 5954428" data-attributes="member: 42582"><p>As others have mentioned, the issue is with "clumping" - whereas in both 3E and 4e, the "surprise round" is a bonus action in the regular initiative sequence - so the people with the benefit of surprise get to go first, but then their actions are spread out in the regular initiative sequence.</p><p></p><p>I don't think anyone is saying it's particular <em>unfair</em> to the PCs. The point is that it can make for boring play if surprise produces a "clumping" situation that can lead to a single PC being hosed before the player even gets to do anything in combat.</p><p></p><p>In that case you may not need actual surprise mechanics at all - if the GM declares that the PCs are surprised your players can just not use their actions for the first round - RPing out the story of their surprise - without regard to what the mechanics say. And the GM can do the same for the monsters when relevant.</p><p></p><p>On the other hand, for those who prefer to use the mechanics, and see them as the principal engine for generating both fiction and play experience, getting things right is important.</p></blockquote><p></p>
[QUOTE="pemerton, post: 5954428, member: 42582"] As others have mentioned, the issue is with "clumping" - whereas in both 3E and 4e, the "surprise round" is a bonus action in the regular initiative sequence - so the people with the benefit of surprise get to go first, but then their actions are spread out in the regular initiative sequence. I don't think anyone is saying it's particular [I]unfair[/I] to the PCs. The point is that it can make for boring play if surprise produces a "clumping" situation that can lead to a single PC being hosed before the player even gets to do anything in combat. In that case you may not need actual surprise mechanics at all - if the GM declares that the PCs are surprised your players can just not use their actions for the first round - RPing out the story of their surprise - without regard to what the mechanics say. And the GM can do the same for the monsters when relevant. On the other hand, for those who prefer to use the mechanics, and see them as the principal engine for generating both fiction and play experience, getting things right is important. [/QUOTE]
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