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Proposal: Dragon 367
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<blockquote data-quote="JoeNotCharles" data-source="post: 4764985" data-attributes="member: 79945"><p>YARGH it ate my post. Quick-ish recap:</p><p></p><p>Forgot about short sword and throwing hammer. You're right. I was thinking of off-hand as meaning "suitable for replacing a main gauche with in the standard sword-and-main-gauche setup", which is obviously wrong.</p><p></p><p>As written the claws only count as weapons for feats and powers, not class features. So no damage bonus from Tempest Technique.</p><p></p><p>Two-Weapon Ranger: as written, claws can't be used as a second weapon even though they count as light blades because this is a class feature, not a feat or power. If off-hand is added, they can be used with two-weapon ranger powers even for Archer and Beastmaster rangers (just like a short sword).</p><p></p><p>All two-weapon feats I can find talk about "wielding two weapons" or applying to "the weapon you're holding in your off-hand", not "a weapon with the off-hand keyword". So adding off-hand keyword wouldn't open up any new feats.</p><p></p><p>Only paragon path I can affind that's affected is Shock Trooper: Deadly Soldier increases damage die size "when you wield an off-hand weapon" - unclear whether that means "a weapon with the off-hand keyword" or "a weapon in your off-hand". (This should be clarified: what about a Ranger dual-wielding longswords who multiclasses into fighter and takes Shock Trooper?) As written does not apply to claws since this is a class feature. Shocking Skewer power is interesting: "must be wielding an off-hand weapon and have a hand free". Even if off-hand keyword is added, a Claw Fighter never has a hand free.</p><p></p><p>Bottom line: claw stats are identical to short sword except no off-hand. If off-hand is added, still inferior because can't be used with class features. If class features allowed, still inferior because can't be enchanted.</p><p></p><p>So I say make this change (my edits in italics):</p><p></p><p></p><p></p><p>This clarifies that claws can be dual-wielded, just like dual short swords. Otherwise, no effect at all on Two-Blade ranger, but Archer and Beastmaster rangers can use them as backup weapons with their two-weapon powers. It allows Tempest Fighters to get their damage bonus using their claws, and Shock Trooper to use Deadly Soldier with them, but still not Shocking Skewer.</p><p></p><p>Basically it becomes "spend a feat to gain two non-magical short swords which you can never lose except through surgery, even when you want to". Seems reasonable to me.</p></blockquote><p></p>
[QUOTE="JoeNotCharles, post: 4764985, member: 79945"] YARGH it ate my post. Quick-ish recap: Forgot about short sword and throwing hammer. You're right. I was thinking of off-hand as meaning "suitable for replacing a main gauche with in the standard sword-and-main-gauche setup", which is obviously wrong. As written the claws only count as weapons for feats and powers, not class features. So no damage bonus from Tempest Technique. Two-Weapon Ranger: as written, claws can't be used as a second weapon even though they count as light blades because this is a class feature, not a feat or power. If off-hand is added, they can be used with two-weapon ranger powers even for Archer and Beastmaster rangers (just like a short sword). All two-weapon feats I can find talk about "wielding two weapons" or applying to "the weapon you're holding in your off-hand", not "a weapon with the off-hand keyword". So adding off-hand keyword wouldn't open up any new feats. Only paragon path I can affind that's affected is Shock Trooper: Deadly Soldier increases damage die size "when you wield an off-hand weapon" - unclear whether that means "a weapon with the off-hand keyword" or "a weapon in your off-hand". (This should be clarified: what about a Ranger dual-wielding longswords who multiclasses into fighter and takes Shock Trooper?) As written does not apply to claws since this is a class feature. Shocking Skewer power is interesting: "must be wielding an off-hand weapon and have a hand free". Even if off-hand keyword is added, a Claw Fighter never has a hand free. Bottom line: claw stats are identical to short sword except no off-hand. If off-hand is added, still inferior because can't be used with class features. If class features allowed, still inferior because can't be enchanted. So I say make this change (my edits in italics): This clarifies that claws can be dual-wielded, just like dual short swords. Otherwise, no effect at all on Two-Blade ranger, but Archer and Beastmaster rangers can use them as backup weapons with their two-weapon powers. It allows Tempest Fighters to get their damage bonus using their claws, and Shock Trooper to use Deadly Soldier with them, but still not Shocking Skewer. Basically it becomes "spend a feat to gain two non-magical short swords which you can never lose except through surgery, even when you want to". Seems reasonable to me. [/QUOTE]
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