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<blockquote data-quote="Kinematics" data-source="post: 7322083" data-attributes="member: 6932123"><p>Now, looking at duration spells.</p><p></p><p></p><p>AOE spells that are not damaging in nature are either, "Target X creatures that you can see within Y feet", or a concentration effect with a duration (eg: Fog Cloud). Given my interests at the moment, I will be focusing on the concentration-duration spells.</p><p></p><p><strong>Fog Cloud</strong> - Level 1</p><p></p><p>20' sphere = 60 area units. It's basically always on the ground, so full sphere volume doesn't matter, and it has minimal value for height above one creature unit.</p><p></p><p>It's level 3 in size. +2 vs spell level.</p><p></p><p>It has a duration of 1 hour.</p><p></p><p>It has one special effect:</p><p>The area is heavily obscured.</p><p></p><p>It has one detriment:</p><p>It can be dispersed with a moderate wind.</p><p></p><p></p><p><strong>Web</strong> - Level 2</p><p></p><p>20' cube = 16 area units / 32 volume units</p><p></p><p>It's level 2 in volume. @ spell level</p><p></p><p>It has a duration of 1 hour.</p><p></p><p>It has various special effects:</p><p>The area is lightly obscured.</p><p>Terrain is difficult</p><p>Dex or restrained</p><p></p><p>It has a detriment:</p><p>Area is flammable, ending spell and doing damage.</p><p></p><p></p><p><strong>Sleet Storm</strong> - Level 3</p><p></p><p>20' high, 40' radius cylinder = 250 area units / 500 volume units. </p><p></p><p>It's roughly level 5, maybe 5.5, in pure volume. +2 to +2.5 vs spell level.</p><p></p><p>It has a duration of 1 minute.</p><p></p><p>It has five special effects:</p><p>Area is heavily obscured</p><p>Fires are extinguished</p><p>Terrain is difficult</p><p>Dex check or fall prone</p><p>Con check or lose concentration</p><p></p><p></p><p></p><p>If I were to try 'buy' Fog Cloud in points, and making up these point costs as I go along, I'd do:</p><p></p><p>size 3 = +2 points</p><p>duration 1hr = +4 point</p><p>heavily obscured = +2 points</p><p>dispersed with moderate wind = -2 points (-1 if strong wind)</p><p></p><p>Total: 6 points (Level + 5, 2*Level + 4, 3*Level + 3)</p><p></p><p></p><p>Then try with Web.</p><p></p><p>size 2 = 0 points</p><p>duration 1hr = +4 points</p><p>lightly obscured = +1 point</p><p>difficult terrain = +1 point</p><p> dex check or restrained (str to escape) = +2</p><p>flammable = -1</p><p>but does damage = +1</p><p></p><p>Total: 8 points (Level + 6, 2*Level + 4, 3*Level + 2)</p><p></p><p></p><p>Then try with Sleet Storm.</p><p></p><p>size 5 = +2 points</p><p>duration 1 min = +2 point</p><p>heavily obscured = +2 points</p><p>difficult terrain = +1 point</p><p>extinguish fires = +0.5 points</p><p>dex check or prone = +1 point</p><p>con check = +1 point</p><p></p><p>Total: 9.5 points (Level + 6, 2*Level + 3.5, 3*Level + 0)</p><p></p><p></p><p>It's likely that my point choices are off in some respects, but it gives a rough scaling to work from: Level + 5, or 2*Level + 3~4. Can at least get a ballpark figure to work from.</p><p></p><p></p><p>For reference on time, I'm using:</p><p></p><p>0 = 1 round</p><p>+1 = 3 rounds</p><p>+2 = 1 minute</p><p>+3 = 10 minutes</p><p>+4 = 1 hour</p><p></p><p>And I considered calculating the size relative to spell level, but decided it was easier to just use the size value directly. All it does it add an extra spell level's worth of points, so the scaling remains consistent.</p><p></p><p></p><p>It <em>might</em> even work for damaging spells, where most of the points are allocated to damage and/or area, and leftover points can go to special effects. However I have no idea how to determine how many points to allocate for "doing damage".</p><p></p><p>Let's try an experiment.</p><p></p><p><strong>Cloudkill</strong> - Level 5</p><p></p><p>20' sphere = Level 4 in volume</p><p>5d8 damage = Level 3 in damage</p><p></p><p>It has a duration of 10 minutes</p><p></p><p>Special effects:</p><p>Heavily obscured</p><p></p><p>Detriments:</p><p>Dispersed by strong wind</p><p></p><p></p><p>Points:</p><p>size -1 = -1 points</p><p>heavily obscured = +2</p><p>dispersed in strong wind = -1</p><p>duration (10 min) = +3</p><p>poison damage = +1</p><p>damage -2 = +??</p><p></p><p>Total: 4 + damage</p><p></p><p>Expected total: Level+5 = 10, 2*Level+3 = 13</p><p></p><p>Level 3 Damage = 6 or 9 points</p><p></p><p>However I think the duration affects this more strongly as a damaging spell. So:</p><p></p><p></p><p>Points:</p><p>size -1 = -1 points</p><p>heavily obscured = +2</p><p>dispersed in strong wind = -1</p><p>duration (10 min) = +3*2 = +6</p><p>poison damage = +1</p><p>damage -2 = +??</p><p></p><p>Total: 7 + damage</p><p></p><p>Expected total: Level+5 = 10, 2*Level+3 = 13</p><p></p><p>Level 3 Damage = 3 or 6 points</p><p></p><p>I could see 1 or 2 points per damage tier.</p><p></p><p></p><p>So, overall, have a methodology of handling spells with duration. A lot of guesswork still involved, but at least can have an idea of if it's close.</p><p></p><p>Does this seem reasonable?</p></blockquote><p></p>
[QUOTE="Kinematics, post: 7322083, member: 6932123"] Now, looking at duration spells. AOE spells that are not damaging in nature are either, "Target X creatures that you can see within Y feet", or a concentration effect with a duration (eg: Fog Cloud). Given my interests at the moment, I will be focusing on the concentration-duration spells. [B]Fog Cloud[/B] - Level 1 20' sphere = 60 area units. It's basically always on the ground, so full sphere volume doesn't matter, and it has minimal value for height above one creature unit. It's level 3 in size. +2 vs spell level. It has a duration of 1 hour. It has one special effect: The area is heavily obscured. It has one detriment: It can be dispersed with a moderate wind. [B]Web[/B] - Level 2 20' cube = 16 area units / 32 volume units It's level 2 in volume. @ spell level It has a duration of 1 hour. It has various special effects: The area is lightly obscured. Terrain is difficult Dex or restrained It has a detriment: Area is flammable, ending spell and doing damage. [B]Sleet Storm[/B] - Level 3 20' high, 40' radius cylinder = 250 area units / 500 volume units. It's roughly level 5, maybe 5.5, in pure volume. +2 to +2.5 vs spell level. It has a duration of 1 minute. It has five special effects: Area is heavily obscured Fires are extinguished Terrain is difficult Dex check or fall prone Con check or lose concentration If I were to try 'buy' Fog Cloud in points, and making up these point costs as I go along, I'd do: size 3 = +2 points duration 1hr = +4 point heavily obscured = +2 points dispersed with moderate wind = -2 points (-1 if strong wind) Total: 6 points (Level + 5, 2*Level + 4, 3*Level + 3) Then try with Web. size 2 = 0 points duration 1hr = +4 points lightly obscured = +1 point difficult terrain = +1 point dex check or restrained (str to escape) = +2 flammable = -1 but does damage = +1 Total: 8 points (Level + 6, 2*Level + 4, 3*Level + 2) Then try with Sleet Storm. size 5 = +2 points duration 1 min = +2 point heavily obscured = +2 points difficult terrain = +1 point extinguish fires = +0.5 points dex check or prone = +1 point con check = +1 point Total: 9.5 points (Level + 6, 2*Level + 3.5, 3*Level + 0) It's likely that my point choices are off in some respects, but it gives a rough scaling to work from: Level + 5, or 2*Level + 3~4. Can at least get a ballpark figure to work from. For reference on time, I'm using: 0 = 1 round +1 = 3 rounds +2 = 1 minute +3 = 10 minutes +4 = 1 hour And I considered calculating the size relative to spell level, but decided it was easier to just use the size value directly. All it does it add an extra spell level's worth of points, so the scaling remains consistent. It [I]might[/I] even work for damaging spells, where most of the points are allocated to damage and/or area, and leftover points can go to special effects. However I have no idea how to determine how many points to allocate for "doing damage". Let's try an experiment. [B]Cloudkill[/B] - Level 5 20' sphere = Level 4 in volume 5d8 damage = Level 3 in damage It has a duration of 10 minutes Special effects: Heavily obscured Detriments: Dispersed by strong wind Points: size -1 = -1 points heavily obscured = +2 dispersed in strong wind = -1 duration (10 min) = +3 poison damage = +1 damage -2 = +?? Total: 4 + damage Expected total: Level+5 = 10, 2*Level+3 = 13 Level 3 Damage = 6 or 9 points However I think the duration affects this more strongly as a damaging spell. So: Points: size -1 = -1 points heavily obscured = +2 dispersed in strong wind = -1 duration (10 min) = +3*2 = +6 poison damage = +1 damage -2 = +?? Total: 7 + damage Expected total: Level+5 = 10, 2*Level+3 = 13 Level 3 Damage = 3 or 6 points I could see 1 or 2 points per damage tier. So, overall, have a methodology of handling spells with duration. A lot of guesswork still involved, but at least can have an idea of if it's close. Does this seem reasonable? [/QUOTE]
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