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*Pathfinder & Starfinder
Rethinking the 3-Book Model
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<blockquote data-quote="Crazy Jerome" data-source="post: 5911656" data-attributes="member: 54877"><p>Sure, but as opposed to what exactly? The model where you go look in the Advanced Whatitzname Book for Martial Completeness? Monster Supreme Collection 3.14? Essential Guide to D&Ding in the Snow? <img src="data:image/gif;base64,R0lGODlhAQABAIAAAAAAAP///yH5BAEAAAAALAAAAAABAAEAAAIBRAA7" class="smilie smilie--sprite smilie--sprite8" alt=":D" title="Big grin :D" loading="lazy" data-shortname=":D" /> </p><p> </p><p>Also, I didn't mean to give the impression that this is how BECMI/RC and AD&D 1E were designed exactly. For one thing, RC came much later, and though there is a lot of easy conversion between them, BECMI and AD&D are separate games. RC is mainly a good example because it is a lot of complete D&D in one book, accomplished by keeping the monsters, magic items, advice, etc. rather concise.</p><p> </p><p></p><p> </p><p>Some people have said this, but not me. I'd want the core book to not be repeated--partially because it's the one and only source of the main rules in my model, but also because if you make a complete but limited set of options in it, they shouldn't need to be repeated. </p><p> </p><p>(Replying to both) Also keep in mind that they are talking lots of options here. So under the kind of thing I wrote, let's say you have the fighter, wizard, rogue, and cleric in the core book, along with some very traditional monsters and magic items and the other stuff I listed. These are things you use all the time, and pretty soon you get used to them being there. If you want a fighter, you always start here. If you want a bard, you start in the PHB. The core, default stuff that everyone uses is in the core book. That optional section for advanced maneuvers (for all martial characters) is in the PHB. </p><p> </p><p>I'll grant that it is a little goofy from a class-building perspective, and maybe from picking monsters and magic items. But hey, if we have a lot to pick from, that stuff is going to be in multiple books anyway. There is going to be optional stuff that applies across classes that would end up in separate books. So everything that applies to a given class isn't going to be in one book anyway. </p><p> </p><p>It's a decent trade to me to have a clean introduction to the game for new players, that isn't a crippled "starter set" that you really can't do much with or learn to play "real 5E D&D" with. Plus, I suspect that this model would release page count in the PHB, DMG, MM, allowing those books to explore what people want a little better.</p><p> </p><p>The PHB might extend classes only by bard, druid, paladin, and ranger. But then it needs not only the default themes and backgrounds for those classes, but all of the extra themes and backgrounds that didn't make the core book. It needs any extra spells for bard, druid, etc. And then it needs the extra spells for optional modules, perhaps such as rituals.</p><p> </p><p>Whatever. The stuff used to replicate the traditional 8+ classes from prior versions is going to take multiple books. It's not a question of if but how. <img src="http://www.enworld.org/forum/images/smilies/angel.png" class="smilie" loading="lazy" alt=":angel:" title="Angel :angel:" data-shortname=":angel:" /></p></blockquote><p></p>
[QUOTE="Crazy Jerome, post: 5911656, member: 54877"] Sure, but as opposed to what exactly? The model where you go look in the Advanced Whatitzname Book for Martial Completeness? Monster Supreme Collection 3.14? Essential Guide to D&Ding in the Snow? :D Also, I didn't mean to give the impression that this is how BECMI/RC and AD&D 1E were designed exactly. For one thing, RC came much later, and though there is a lot of easy conversion between them, BECMI and AD&D are separate games. RC is mainly a good example because it is a lot of complete D&D in one book, accomplished by keeping the monsters, magic items, advice, etc. rather concise. Some people have said this, but not me. I'd want the core book to not be repeated--partially because it's the one and only source of the main rules in my model, but also because if you make a complete but limited set of options in it, they shouldn't need to be repeated. (Replying to both) Also keep in mind that they are talking lots of options here. So under the kind of thing I wrote, let's say you have the fighter, wizard, rogue, and cleric in the core book, along with some very traditional monsters and magic items and the other stuff I listed. These are things you use all the time, and pretty soon you get used to them being there. If you want a fighter, you always start here. If you want a bard, you start in the PHB. The core, default stuff that everyone uses is in the core book. That optional section for advanced maneuvers (for all martial characters) is in the PHB. I'll grant that it is a little goofy from a class-building perspective, and maybe from picking monsters and magic items. But hey, if we have a lot to pick from, that stuff is going to be in multiple books anyway. There is going to be optional stuff that applies across classes that would end up in separate books. So everything that applies to a given class isn't going to be in one book anyway. It's a decent trade to me to have a clean introduction to the game for new players, that isn't a crippled "starter set" that you really can't do much with or learn to play "real 5E D&D" with. Plus, I suspect that this model would release page count in the PHB, DMG, MM, allowing those books to explore what people want a little better. The PHB might extend classes only by bard, druid, paladin, and ranger. But then it needs not only the default themes and backgrounds for those classes, but all of the extra themes and backgrounds that didn't make the core book. It needs any extra spells for bard, druid, etc. And then it needs the extra spells for optional modules, perhaps such as rituals. Whatever. The stuff used to replicate the traditional 8+ classes from prior versions is going to take multiple books. It's not a question of if but how. :angel: [/QUOTE]
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Rethinking the 3-Book Model
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