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RPG Combat: Sport or War?
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<blockquote data-quote="Jhaelen" data-source="post: 7726705" data-attributes="member: 46713"><p>Interestingly, my highest pc ever (pre-4e) reached level 8. I've played dozen of characters but I never managed to reach a higher level. Apparently, I either suck at playing or I'm incredibly unlucky, right?</p><p></p><p>I've always wondered about tales from other groups who apparently regularly reached epic levels and were traveling the multiverse killing gods as an exercise before their breakfast.</p><p>The answer is simple: They weren't playing the same game as our group: They used house-rules, their DMs were pulling blows, their opponents were acting stupid, they started at higher levels, they were decked out in magical treasures and artifacts, etc, etc.</p><p></p><p>By the time you're about to reach class levels territory, all monsters have save-or-die powers, often affecting the entire party at once (mind-flayers, beholders, etc.). There simply isn't any way to survive such encounters on a level battlefield repeatedly. This is mostly true in 1st and 2nd edition.</p><p>In 3rd edition some changes were introduced to increase the odds for the pcs:</p><p>- a somewhat accurate challenge rating system and rules for encounter design.</p><p>- easier access to resurrection powers</p><p>- a simple system for crafting magic items</p><p>- a revised action system favoring the pcs with plenty of swift and free action spells and powers</p><p>Despite of all this, in my 3e campaign, advancement started to falter at a certain point. In the end the highest pc had about level 13. In the last two or three adventures one or more PCs died in almost every combat.</p><p></p><p>4e by comparison was a cakewalk. We still had a couple of character deaths, but managed to reach level 15 without much trouble. And if the campaign hadn't fizzled, I don't think that would have changed.</p><p>The reason is of course that combat encounters are meant to be cinematic: the way monsters work creates a dramatic arc. They're mostly front-loaded and have few means to recover or heal. So the PCs get hit hard in the beginning and often one or more of them drop, but they have a lot more staying power, so they slowly turn the tide and are almost guaranteed to win. If a character actually dies, it's usually only by accident, because of a string of bad luck. This results in combats that are always exciting without being actually threatening, and it's firmly in the realm of 'combat as a sport'.</p><p></p><p>It depends on what you're trying to calculate:</p><p>The chance to survive a sequence of 80 encounters, each with a survivability percentage of 75%? You _definitely_ have to multiply the percentages: you have to survive the first encounter in order to even make it to the second!</p></blockquote><p></p>
[QUOTE="Jhaelen, post: 7726705, member: 46713"] Interestingly, my highest pc ever (pre-4e) reached level 8. I've played dozen of characters but I never managed to reach a higher level. Apparently, I either suck at playing or I'm incredibly unlucky, right? I've always wondered about tales from other groups who apparently regularly reached epic levels and were traveling the multiverse killing gods as an exercise before their breakfast. The answer is simple: They weren't playing the same game as our group: They used house-rules, their DMs were pulling blows, their opponents were acting stupid, they started at higher levels, they were decked out in magical treasures and artifacts, etc, etc. By the time you're about to reach class levels territory, all monsters have save-or-die powers, often affecting the entire party at once (mind-flayers, beholders, etc.). There simply isn't any way to survive such encounters on a level battlefield repeatedly. This is mostly true in 1st and 2nd edition. In 3rd edition some changes were introduced to increase the odds for the pcs: - a somewhat accurate challenge rating system and rules for encounter design. - easier access to resurrection powers - a simple system for crafting magic items - a revised action system favoring the pcs with plenty of swift and free action spells and powers Despite of all this, in my 3e campaign, advancement started to falter at a certain point. In the end the highest pc had about level 13. In the last two or three adventures one or more PCs died in almost every combat. 4e by comparison was a cakewalk. We still had a couple of character deaths, but managed to reach level 15 without much trouble. And if the campaign hadn't fizzled, I don't think that would have changed. The reason is of course that combat encounters are meant to be cinematic: the way monsters work creates a dramatic arc. They're mostly front-loaded and have few means to recover or heal. So the PCs get hit hard in the beginning and often one or more of them drop, but they have a lot more staying power, so they slowly turn the tide and are almost guaranteed to win. If a character actually dies, it's usually only by accident, because of a string of bad luck. This results in combats that are always exciting without being actually threatening, and it's firmly in the realm of 'combat as a sport'. It depends on what you're trying to calculate: The chance to survive a sequence of 80 encounters, each with a survivability percentage of 75%? You _definitely_ have to multiply the percentages: you have to survive the first encounter in order to even make it to the second! [/QUOTE]
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