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<blockquote data-quote="Aegeri" data-source="post: 5547312" data-attributes="member: 78116"><p>That actually is a really good point Colmarr, there is indeed very little point to using them in a smart way. The game directly rewards upping your DPR as much as possible, because as the old adage goes "The best condition to impose is <em>dead</em>". Indeed for many rangers, the point of stocking up on these attacks is to attack 3 times a round (5+ with an action point) every single round to incredibly boost damage. A twin strike + brutal barrage + disruptive strike in one round, for a good nova example. The disruptive strike is used regardless of its effect, just to boost damage and kill the creature faster. Indeed these powers are used 90% of the time very well in this manner.</p><p></p><p>The fact is that you can get away with using these powers stupidly and with no regard to if they'll help or not. If you're loading up on them, you're going to be using 1/round regardless of the actual situation. This results in the rangers hideous DPR compared to every striker in the game for example. Sure every now and again a corner case like my example above will backfire, but the game directly rewards the "stupid" usage more than a tactical usage. If a monster you have quarried (and whatever else) hits, you use it. Then next round, you use your other immediate interrupt power etc.</p><p></p><p>In this way you just do way more damage than everyone else and consistently out action every other character. It has become a major flaw of these actions.</p><p>With a -5 (or whatever it is, something hideous) penalty to attacks you would certainly hope so. Actually I've seen it fail to negate the attack rarely, it's just if the attack actually mattered in the first place.</p><p></p><p>Edit:</p><p></p><p>Well I can't provide said evidence, because the number of ACTUAL real and entirely non-theorycraft times I've seen it matter is like, four? The example above with the shadow would probably be the best one, bearing in mind the shadow was pushed away by turn undead and then immobilized as well. Unfortunately the PCs didn't expect it to be able to teleport back to the downed character and finish him off anyway - so that's a REAL corner case right there. In reality, most of the time killing something faster is just the better strategy. Getting as many OoT (Out of Turn) attacks as possible, then using them as much as you can (you only get 1/round anyway) is just doing a lot more damage than being conservative.</p><p></p><p>I mean it doesn't require evidence to realize attacking 3 times per round for a ranger (Twin Strike + Encounter OoT attack) is BETTER than just using twin strike every round. So the more lenient the attacks triggers the better they are and the more likely you get that extra attack every round. Especially if you're a battlefield archer, because that means you are more likely to drop an enemy and get an AP every encounter for an additional standard action attack (albeit you can't use two APs in an encounter, even with battlefield archer). Once you play a lot of paragon and epic tier, you can really see how the effects of the extra damage from classes that have easy access to OoT attacks compared to others really changes them. A high level ranger is scarier than any other striker in the game by miles.</p></blockquote><p></p>
[QUOTE="Aegeri, post: 5547312, member: 78116"] That actually is a really good point Colmarr, there is indeed very little point to using them in a smart way. The game directly rewards upping your DPR as much as possible, because as the old adage goes "The best condition to impose is [I]dead[/I]". Indeed for many rangers, the point of stocking up on these attacks is to attack 3 times a round (5+ with an action point) every single round to incredibly boost damage. A twin strike + brutal barrage + disruptive strike in one round, for a good nova example. The disruptive strike is used regardless of its effect, just to boost damage and kill the creature faster. Indeed these powers are used 90% of the time very well in this manner. The fact is that you can get away with using these powers stupidly and with no regard to if they'll help or not. If you're loading up on them, you're going to be using 1/round regardless of the actual situation. This results in the rangers hideous DPR compared to every striker in the game for example. Sure every now and again a corner case like my example above will backfire, but the game directly rewards the "stupid" usage more than a tactical usage. If a monster you have quarried (and whatever else) hits, you use it. Then next round, you use your other immediate interrupt power etc. In this way you just do way more damage than everyone else and consistently out action every other character. It has become a major flaw of these actions. With a -5 (or whatever it is, something hideous) penalty to attacks you would certainly hope so. Actually I've seen it fail to negate the attack rarely, it's just if the attack actually mattered in the first place. Edit: Well I can't provide said evidence, because the number of ACTUAL real and entirely non-theorycraft times I've seen it matter is like, four? The example above with the shadow would probably be the best one, bearing in mind the shadow was pushed away by turn undead and then immobilized as well. Unfortunately the PCs didn't expect it to be able to teleport back to the downed character and finish him off anyway - so that's a REAL corner case right there. In reality, most of the time killing something faster is just the better strategy. Getting as many OoT (Out of Turn) attacks as possible, then using them as much as you can (you only get 1/round anyway) is just doing a lot more damage than being conservative. I mean it doesn't require evidence to realize attacking 3 times per round for a ranger (Twin Strike + Encounter OoT attack) is BETTER than just using twin strike every round. So the more lenient the attacks triggers the better they are and the more likely you get that extra attack every round. Especially if you're a battlefield archer, because that means you are more likely to drop an enemy and get an AP every encounter for an additional standard action attack (albeit you can't use two APs in an encounter, even with battlefield archer). Once you play a lot of paragon and epic tier, you can really see how the effects of the extra damage from classes that have easy access to OoT attacks compared to others really changes them. A high level ranger is scarier than any other striker in the game by miles. [/QUOTE]
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