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<blockquote data-quote="Arial Black" data-source="post: 7564911" data-attributes="member: 6799649"><p>The fallacy of special pleading. All of these actions, including the Attack action, are in the same form: 'take the (whatever) action -> you can do the things that the action allows for the specified time'. And yet you assert, without evidence, that it works differently for the Attack action.</p><p></p><p>Let's take Dodge: in game rules, you 'take the Dodge action'. Then, <em>when attacked</em>, the attacker rolls with disadvantage. The actual 'dodging' happens either only when you are being attacked or you are dodging for then entire duration. You don't take all your dodges <strong>now</strong>, then stop dodging, then subsequent attacks have disadvantage anyway! So you are <em>actually</em> dodging at various points within the time span between taking the action and the start of your next turn, or you are actively dodging for that entire duration without stopping.</p><p></p><p>Similarly, with the Attack action, you might 'take the Attack' action <em>now</em>, but <em>actually</em> attack later in the round. We know for a fact that this is permissible for your second and subsequent attacks, even though it is unclear if it also applies to your first attack.</p><p></p><p>There is no difference in RAW re: 'instantaneous action->game effect for a duration' and 'the action's effect has a duration', between how the rules apply to the Attack action and the Dodge, Disengage and Hide actions. So, either they ALL work as 'instantaneous->effect' OR as 'action has a duration'. Saying that the Attack action is treated differently, without rules back-up, is special pleading and leads to an unsafe conclusion. </p><p></p><p></p><p></p><p>This is the 'argument from ignorance' fallacy. Here you are asserting, without support, that there are ONLY two options, just because you don't know of other options. There is at least one more option, and there may be more:-</p><p></p><p>3) Play the Rules As Written. What JEC says or means is irrelevant to RAW.</p></blockquote><p></p>
[QUOTE="Arial Black, post: 7564911, member: 6799649"] The fallacy of special pleading. All of these actions, including the Attack action, are in the same form: 'take the (whatever) action -> you can do the things that the action allows for the specified time'. And yet you assert, without evidence, that it works differently for the Attack action. Let's take Dodge: in game rules, you 'take the Dodge action'. Then, [i]when attacked[/i], the attacker rolls with disadvantage. The actual 'dodging' happens either only when you are being attacked or you are dodging for then entire duration. You don't take all your dodges [b]now[/b], then stop dodging, then subsequent attacks have disadvantage anyway! So you are [i]actually[/i] dodging at various points within the time span between taking the action and the start of your next turn, or you are actively dodging for that entire duration without stopping. Similarly, with the Attack action, you might 'take the Attack' action [i]now[/i], but [i]actually[/i] attack later in the round. We know for a fact that this is permissible for your second and subsequent attacks, even though it is unclear if it also applies to your first attack. There is no difference in RAW re: 'instantaneous action->game effect for a duration' and 'the action's effect has a duration', between how the rules apply to the Attack action and the Dodge, Disengage and Hide actions. So, either they ALL work as 'instantaneous->effect' OR as 'action has a duration'. Saying that the Attack action is treated differently, without rules back-up, is special pleading and leads to an unsafe conclusion. This is the 'argument from ignorance' fallacy. Here you are asserting, without support, that there are ONLY two options, just because you don't know of other options. There is at least one more option, and there may be more:- 3) Play the Rules As Written. What JEC says or means is irrelevant to RAW. [/QUOTE]
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